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Thread: U.S. Soldier Dismissed for Threats in Iraq Protest

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Susanna View Post
    Been there, done that; go back through my posts if you really want to know.
    I have seen this ploy before from those who can not justify what they say so they turn it around and make you go to the trouble of looking it all up knowing full well they will refute it anyway. I have even seen them gloat that they made someone do this.



    s is suWhen Chuck Norris was in middle school, his English teacher assigned an essay: "What is courage?" He received an A+ for turning in a blank page with only his name at the top.pposed to be the second oldest profession. I have come to realize that it bears a very close resemblance to the first.
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  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bremen View Post
    I went back and checked through your posts. It seems that I could not find where you specifically addressed liberty vs. license issue you are accusing me of confusing. Especially when dealing with me.

    It's ok if you just want to make statements but if you do not want to discuss them then I won't be responding anymore. I am sure by the tone of your posts you could care less but this is how people communicate.
    I have addressed it many times; if you didn't see it, that's your problem. I posted about in on my blog a while ago, too, and put a link to it here.

    It won't hurt my feelings if you stop responding to me. I have been borderline on whether or not to put you on ignore almost as long as you've been on this site.
    Last edited by Susanna; 04-19-2010 at 04:06 PM.

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  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bremen View Post
    You are correct I see people as individuals and do concern myself with the collective.
    In the context of this discussion this sounds to me more like you are an anarchist. Absolute liberty is anarchy. Ordered liberty is what the American ideal is and that in part is why people are allowed to enlist. I encourage you to read "Liberty and Tyranny" by Mark Levin. He explains this very well in the early chapters.
    "All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing."

    "The world will know that free men stood against a tyrant, that few stood against many, and before this battle was over, even a god-king can bleed."

  4. #34
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    On the topic:

    By going back on his word breaking the enlistment contract this soldier is a disgrace. A man is nothing if he's not good for his word.
    "All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing."

    "The world will know that free men stood against a tyrant, that few stood against many, and before this battle was over, even a god-king can bleed."

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ictoanius View Post
    In the context of this discussion this sounds to me more like you are an anarchist. Absolute liberty is anarchy. Ordered liberty is what the American ideal is and that in part is why people are allowed to enlist. I encourage you to read "Liberty and Tyranny" by Mark Levin. He explains this very well in the early chapters.
    I do not advocate anarchy as you see it. I advocate a voluntary society. Levin likes war too much for me to read his book.

    Here is a good review of Levin's book Taki
    An excerpt I liked.
    That it is “statists” who question the constitutionality of the PATRIOT Act or the morality of torture makes zero sense. If he were honest, Levin would concede that increasing government power, whether by allowing it to spy on citizens or the executive branch redefining interrogation methods to circumvent the law, are inherently “statist” measures that he just happens to believe are necessary.
    Levin is not stupid, and it’s almost impossible to imagine him believing his own words… But regardless, his fans do. Attending the 4th of July Tea Party here in Charleston, the crowd of roughly 1,000 were asked to register for the event, and after writing your name, address and email, a smiling woman handed you a one page copy of Levin’s 10 point “conservative manifesto.” On each point, taxation, the environment, judges, government, education, immigration, entitlements, faith and the Constitution, the vague language is something virtually all conservative could agree on. On point 8, or “foreign policy and security,” Levin is no more explicit:

    Ensure that all foreign policy decisions are made for the purpose of preserving and improving American society. Reject all treaties, entanglements, institutions, and enterprises that have as their purpose the supplantation of America’s best interest, including its physical, cultural, economic and military sovereignty, to an amorphous ‘global’ interest… Ensure that America remains the world’s superpower. Ensure that at all times America’s military forces are prepared for war to dissuade attacks, encourage peace, and, if necessary, win any war.

    Parts of Levin’s foreign policy program could be interpreted as “isolationist” (rejecting “entanglements” and “global interests”), and yet Levin’s career-long philosophy has been that there’s no use in being a superpower unless you let the rest of the world know what makes America so militarily super. It’s this jumble of appealing, traditional conservative language combined with full blown neoconservatism—an ideology even its adherents admit isn’t conducive to small government—that allows pundits like Levin to inflict so much damage on the Right.
    Last edited by Bremen; 04-19-2010 at 06:44 PM.
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  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ictoanius View Post
    On the topic:

    By going back on his word breaking the enlistment contract this soldier is a disgrace. A man is nothing if he's not good for his word.
    So spending 3 years and 10 months as a enlisted soldier is a disgrace? The soldier found out that his unit was going to be deployed to war for another year when he had 2 months left to finish his obligations. He was angry and spoke out about how he felt this was unfair.
    Sapere aude

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bremen View Post
    You just restated the other argument that I countered. Attack this argument, A person can not contract their free will away therefore the soldier had a right to refuse to go to war.

    Remember this is not just left wing or right wing this is my philosophy. It will be very consistent.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bremen View Post
    Can you explain yourself so that I may understand why you think that the philosophy of liberty is childish? I would be interested to see what you come up with.
    Interesting that you didn't answer me after finding fault with them. And BS to your "can't contract their free will away" crap. You sound more like a lawyer looking for a loophole for unacceptably bad behavior than someone who cares either about the way the real world works in a military environment.
    The enemy wants men to concern themselves with what they do. Our business is to keep them thinking about what will happen to them. -- Screwtape
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  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fantasy Chaser View Post
    Interesting that you didn't answer me after finding fault with them. And BS to your "can't contract their free will away" crap. You sound more like a lawyer looking for a loophole for unacceptably bad behavior than someone who cares either about the way the real world works in a military environment.
    How do you want me to respond to the statement that my argument is BS and that it sounds like lawyer speak? Your comments do not attack my argument, they just insult them. There is really nothing of substance to respond to other than to point out the fact that they are just insults.
    Sapere aude

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bremen View Post
    I went back and checked through your posts. It seems that I could not find where you specifically addressed liberty vs. license issue you are accusing me of confusing. Especially when dealing with me.

    It's ok if you just want to make statements but if you do not want to discuss them then I won't be responding anymore. I am sure by the tone of your posts you could care less but this is how people communicate.
    I just noticed this - you checked through 33,000+ posts in about half an hour.

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    Isn't it funny how so many people think that "science" can do anything and everything, but God (if they even acknowledge His existence) can't do much of anything? - Me

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bremen View Post
    How do you want me to respond to the statement that my argument is BS and that it sounds like lawyer speak? Your comments do not attack my argument, they just insult them. There is really nothing of substance to respond to other than to point out the fact that they are just insults.
    First of all, here's my original post that you didn't respond to:

    Quote Originally Posted by Fantasy Chaser View Post
    You're full of it. If you knew anything about the military and why they do things the way they do, you'd understand why your way is a load of crap. It's the United States Armed Forces, not the Obey Orders When You Feel Like It Club.
    Second of all, I did address your argument when I pointed out that there's a difference between your lawyer-talk and the real world. Third, calling your argument crap may be indelicate, but it is not an insult. It is a colorfully expressed truth.

    Oh, and if things were done your way, we would be conquered, and nobody would have nearly as much freedom as an American military man. You're defending the actions of a creep who not only violated any number of military regulations, but also made death threats. Even civilians don't get to go around doing that.
    The enemy wants men to concern themselves with what they do. Our business is to keep them thinking about what will happen to them. -- Screwtape
    REAL men don't exploit girls and women. They protect them. -- Me
    Treat a lady like a lady, and treat a tramp like the lady who's inside of her, the lady who God made her to be. -- Me
    Keep the equality of people, and the hierarchy of ideas. -- Dr. Ravi Zacharias
    I don't believe in treatin' girls equal. I believe in lookin' up to 'em. -- Moose Mason
    Mister Sharp. -- Bovril

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