Computer Talk - Random Thought Thread

[Bullseyed]

Since we've been hijacking the random though thread, I figured I'd try to start one over here. Random tech questions, comments, epeen waving, etc.


I'll start with an issue I've been having, that I think I might have a solution for, but haven't tried yet. (Haven't had time).

I have 4 gig of OCZ platinum ram, but have only been using 2 gig because of my 32 bit OS. When I throw the other stick in, windows recognizes 3.25gig as it should, and running memtest on the ram shows all systems go even at full load on the ram and my quad core processor.

...but... as soon as I load into WoW with it, I get problems. Once I have played long enough for WoW to take up a large enough portion of the ram, the computer just powers off. Sometimes blue screen, sometimes not. When it boots back up, if I load WoW it will shut down very quickly again. (It seems like the ram doesn't clear during the crash somehow) If I reboot after the crash, it will be fine again until I play WoW long enough to fill the ram again. I can't for the life of me figure out why. It seems that WoW tried to go beyond the 3.25 gig and use the unaddressable ram and then causes the crash.

The theory I have worked up in my head it that it might be because I have the ram seated in the primary paired slots on my motherboard. They are both 2 gig sticks, but since 1.25 gig is all that is being recognized on the second stick, does the computer consider them to be different sizes? Should I then off-seat them into non-paired slots? I've been tossing the idea around in my head for a while, but haven't gotten around to trying it out.

I don't think it is an issue of a bad ram dim either. I've tried running with either stick as a 2 gig system with no problems. I'm considering calling up OCZ and seeing what they think about it. They do 3 year warranties on all their stuff AFAIK.


Feel free to jack the thread to talk about whatever though. (Wants to learn more about water cooling, from a firsthand experience POV)

[samspade]

Since we've been hijacking the random though thread, I figured I'd try to start one over here. Random tech questions, comments, epeen waving, etc.


I'll start with an issue I've been having, that I think I might have a solution for, but haven't tried yet. (Haven't had time).

I have 4 gig of OCZ platinum ram, but have only been using 2 gig because of my 32 bit OS. When I throw the other stick in, windows recognizes 3.25gig as it should, and running memtest on the ram shows all systems go even at full load on the ram and my quad core processor.

...but... as soon as I load into WoW with it, I get problems. Once I have played long enough for WoW to take up a large enough portion of the ram, the computer just powers off. Sometimes blue screen, sometimes not. When it boots back up, if I load WoW it will shut down very quickly again. (It seems like the ram doesn't clear during the crash somehow) If I reboot after the crash, it will be fine again until I play WoW long enough to fill the ram again. I can't for the life of me figure out why. It seems that WoW tried to go beyond the 3.25 gig and use the unaddressable ram and then causes the crash.

The theory I have worked up in my head it that it might be because I have the ram seated in the primary paired slots on my motherboard. They are both 2 gig sticks, but since 1.25 gig is all that is being recognized on the second stick, does the computer consider them to be different sizes? Should I then off-seat them into non-paired slots? I've been tossing the idea around in my head for a while, but haven't gotten around to trying it out.

I don't think it is an issue of a bad ram dim either. I've tried running with either stick as a 2 gig system with no problems. I'm considering calling up OCZ and seeing what they think about it. They do 3 year warranties on all their stuff AFAIK.


Feel free to jack the thread to talk about whatever though. (Wants to learn more about water cooling, from a firsthand experience POV)

It's a known fact that 32-bit platforms have limitations when it comes to address volumes of memory larger or equal to 4 GB. And in this respect, the x86 editions of Windows Vista are no

google_protectAndRun("ads_core.google_render_ad", google_handleError, google_render_ad);

exception. Vista will literally eat up RAM, swallowing a consistent amount, larger than 500 MB in the scenario where you would run a 32-bit edition of the operating system on a configuration with 4 GB of RAM.

Windows Vista's memory manager in the x86 variants of the operating system is restricted to 4GB of memory due to the limitations of the 32-bit hardware. The 32-bit address range cannot be filled exclusively with RAM, because the physical address space needs to be divided among the hardware in your system.

Due to these limitations, 32-bit Windows Vista will only be able to address approximately 3.5 GB of RAM. However, there is a way around this. One that will enable you to enjoy the full extent of 4 GB of memory. Still, you should be aware of the fact that in the vicinity of 4 GB of memory, 32-bit Windows Vista will not manage RAM efficiently.

If you indeed want or need to use more than 4 GB of RAM, then you should consider switching to 64-bit platforms. The 64-bit editions of Windows Vista deliver support for as much as 128 GB of memory, so you can go all out.

But as far as 32-bit versions of the operating system are concerned, all you have to do is access cmd via Start, then enter cmd in the search bar and make sure you run it with administrative privileges. Next simply type "BCDEdit /set PAE forceenable" and hit enter. This command will enable Physical Address Extension (PAE) in 32-bit Windows Vista, and the operating system will be able to address memory larger than 4 GB. Via BCDEdit, you will be able to configure the boot configuration data store via the command line.
Feed 4 GB of RAM to 32-bit Windows Vista - No more memory limitations - Softpedia

[Bullseyed]

It's a known fact that 32-bit platforms have limitations when it comes to address volumes of memory larger or equal to 4 GB. And in this respect, the x86 editions of Windows Vista are no

google_protectAndRun("ads_core.google_render_ad", google_handleError, google_render_ad);

exception. Vista will literally eat up RAM, swallowing a consistent amount, larger than 500 MB in the scenario where you would run a 32-bit edition of the operating system on a configuration with 4 GB of RAM.

Windows Vista's memory manager in the x86 variants of the operating system is restricted to 4GB of memory due to the limitations of the 32-bit hardware. The 32-bit address range cannot be filled exclusively with RAM, because the physical address space needs to be divided among the hardware in your system.

Due to these limitations, 32-bit Windows Vista will only be able to address approximately 3.5 GB of RAM. However, there is a way around this. One that will enable you to enjoy the full extent of 4 GB of memory. Still, you should be aware of the fact that in the vicinity of 4 GB of memory, 32-bit Windows Vista will not manage RAM efficiently.

If you indeed want or need to use more than 4 GB of RAM, then you should consider switching to 64-bit platforms. The 64-bit editions of Windows Vista deliver support for as much as 128 GB of memory, so you can go all out.

But as far as 32-bit versions of the operating system are concerned, all you have to do is access cmd via Start, then enter cmd in the search bar and make sure you run it with administrative privileges. Next simply type "BCDEdit /set PAE forceenable" and hit enter. This command will enable Physical Address Extension (PAE) in 32-bit Windows Vista, and the operating system will be able to address memory larger than 4 GB. Via BCDEdit, you will be able to configure the boot configuration data store via the command line.
Feed 4 GB of RAM to 32-bit Windows Vista - No more memory limitations - Softpedia

I know all of that from my computer architecture classes from college. I'm looking for practical experience with seating configurations for ram over 3.5 gig in a 32 bit environment. It is recognized properly by the operating system, it seems to be just certain programs that cause problems.


It is odd that the memtest ram stress test software didn't set off the problem though. I used all the ram available, and all 4 cores of my processor were running at over 80% capacity, with no problem.

I dunno, I'd like to run a 64 bit OS, but last time I tried it destroyed my drivers for my graphics card.

[Maylar]

Since we've been hijacking the random though thread, I figured I'd try to start one over here. Random tech questions, comments, epeen waving, etc.


I'll start with an issue I've been having, that I think I might have a solution for, but haven't tried yet. (Haven't had time).

I have 4 gig of OCZ platinum ram, but have only been using 2 gig because of my 32 bit OS. When I throw the other stick in, windows recognizes 3.25gig as it should, and running memtest on the ram shows all systems go even at full load on the ram and my quad core processor.

...but... as soon as I load into WoW with it, I get problems. Once I have played long enough for WoW to take up a large enough portion of the ram, the computer just powers off. Sometimes blue screen, sometimes not. When it boots back up, if I load WoW it will shut down very quickly again. (It seems like the ram doesn't clear during the crash somehow) If I reboot after the crash, it will be fine again until I play WoW long enough to fill the ram again. I can't for the life of me figure out why. It seems that WoW tried to go beyond the 3.25 gig and use the unaddressable ram and then causes the crash.

The theory I have worked up in my head it that it might be because I have the ram seated in the primary paired slots on my motherboard. They are both 2 gig sticks, but since 1.25 gig is all that is being recognized on the second stick, does the computer consider them to be different sizes? Should I then off-seat them into non-paired slots? I've been tossing the idea around in my head for a while, but haven't gotten around to trying it out.

I don't think it is an issue of a bad ram dim either. I've tried running with either stick as a 2 gig system with no problems. I'm considering calling up OCZ and seeing what they think about it. They do 3 year warranties on all their stuff AFAIK.


Feel free to jack the thread to talk about whatever though. (Wants to learn more about water cooling, from a firsthand experience POV)

WoW is an extremely memory intensive application because of all the variables that it stores. As such memory problems can be more pronounced in wow than other progs.

With that said, what your seeing with the memory is normal. PCI devices need various ranges of the 32 bit address space for I/O, thus that address space can not be mapped to physical memory. You can swap the memory around if you want, but I doubt you will notice any significant change.

Back to your WoW problems, your troubles need more information to diagnose. You seem like an above average computer user, so I'm going to assume you've updated your video/sound/everything else drivers (and if you haven't, go do it and don't admit you didn't). Throw up the error message that your getting with the Blue Screen. Blue screens are often diagnosable but I need to see what it's saying before I can really go further.

As for water cooling, what exactly is it you want to know?

[CWolf]

I doubt very much that your problem is anything other than incomptible RAM. Just because two sticks are said to run on the same voltage, doesn't mean they really are. A lot of times when you have two sticks of ram, you'll find that they work, but only for a while. Certain things can trip them up with one another. If you're lucky, your app will crash, and no system hangs, or reboots.

I can't say this with %100 certainty, but I do not think your problem is 32bit windows. Most people can run 2 2gb sticks without issue.

It sounds to me like your ram sticks are getting out of sync as their temperature increases.

[samspade]

I doubt very much that your problem is anything other than incomptible RAM. Just because two sticks are said to run on the same voltage, doesn't mean they really are. A lot of times when you have two sticks of ram, you'll find that they work, but only for a while. Certain things can trip them up with one another. If you're lucky, your app will crash, and no system hangs, or reboots.

I can't say this with %100 certainty, but I do not think your problem is 32bit windows. Most people can run 2 2gb sticks without issue.

It sounds to me like your ram sticks are getting out of sync as their temperature increases.

That points out that your ram should all be the same kind. In other words if you are going to increase the ram it would be a good Idea to buy all new ram of the same kind preferably with a good heat shield.

I was looking up water cooling and they were saying that unless you are really overclocking and running high end stuff you would get the same results with buying a better fan and heat sink for the processor and it would be a lot cheaper.

[Misty]

But as far as 32-bit versions of the operating system are concerned, all you have to do is access cmd via Start, then enter cmd in the search bar and make sure you run it with administrative privileges. Next simply type "BCDEdit /set PAE forceenable" and hit enter. This command will enable Physical Address Extension (PAE) in 32-bit Windows Vista, and the operating system will be able to address memory larger than 4 GB. Via BCDEdit, you will be able to configure the boot configuration data store via the command line.
Feed 4 GB of RAM to 32-bit Windows Vista - No more memory limitations - Softpedia

Will that work with XP Pro?

[Bullseyed]

I doubt very much that your problem is anything other than incomptible RAM.

It sounds to me like your ram sticks are getting out of sync as their temperature increases.

OCZ Platinum 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model OCZ2P10664GK

Unless I have a bad stick (which I have pretty much covered as a non issue) there isn't any reason for the failure. Again, it is only one specific application I've had the problem with. I've run stress tests on the ram with no error and no random crashes.

[Bullseyed]

WoW is an extremely memory intensive application because of all the variables that it stores. As such memory problems can be more pronounced in wow than other progs.

With that said, what your seeing with the memory is normal. PCI devices need various ranges of the 32 bit address space for I/O, thus that address space can not be mapped to physical memory. You can swap the memory around if you want, but I doubt you will notice any significant change.

Back to your WoW problems, your troubles need more information to diagnose. You seem like an above average computer user, so I'm going to assume you've updated your video/sound/everything else drivers (and if you haven't, go do it and don't admit you didn't). Throw up the error message that your getting with the Blue Screen. Blue screens are often diagnosable but I need to see what it's saying before I can really go further.

As for water cooling, what exactly is it you want to know?

My drivers are up to date. The first time it happened it blue screened, but that was something like 8 or 9 months ago. It used to say something about a memory access error. When it used to do it, it wouldn't display the message for more than a few seconds before rebooting. It doesn't show that message anymore, the screen goes black for a fraction of a second, then it reboots.

[Misty]

Bullseyed, are you on XP or Vista? I'm going to take a shot in the dark and say XP. Am I right?