A Stand Off..

I’m still in process of determining if any of it is true.

I am ashamed to admit that all too often it is the evangelical Christians who are the first to buy into these conspiracy theories. On the other hand, it is somewhat understandable, considering how most of them interpret the book of Revelation.

But - end times activities or not, it’s not what we as Christians should be doing. Instead of running around screaming, “The sky is falling! The sky is falling!” - even if it is - we should be putting in our efforts telling people how to be ready when the sky does “fall” - as it eventually will.

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The people putting out this nonsense are the same folks who think Bush was involved in 9/11 in some fashion, or that the ATF had put “demolition charges” inside the Murrah Building. BS–ALL of it.

If is true, what do you think our response should be?

Also (I admit not reading much of this thread), if you’re still trying to work it out and haven’t committed to the conspiracy theory, if you’re still uncertain, what seems to be the argument in this thread?

The argument seems to be several know-it-alls trying to tell me what to post, not post,and what to think.

No. You’ve posted this crap AS IF it were the absolute truth…it’s not.

[quote=“Carpenter, post:105, topic:46639”]
The argument seems to be several know-it-alls trying to tell me what to post, not post,and what to think.
[/quote]Well, what are you looking for in the discussion?

Are you calling me a liar? I posted it for…DISCUSSION, and it is getting plenty of that…from those who will stay on topic.

The truth.

Several of us have TOLD you the truth, but you ignored them and posted arguments FOR the whole “government conspiracy” nonsense meme.

Sheesh? I NEVER said they were out to get anybody. What I’m trying to understand is why such an apparently large operation is only using 1200 participants. And I see absolutely no reason why we the people can’t question this Administration. You keep saying it’s the military, but last I heard, Obama is the commander in chief of that military, and the Secretary of Defense, who I assume is on board with this, is his cabinet pick, and serves at his pleasure.

Obama has removed an alarming number of top military commanders and replaced them with others, that I assume are more to his liking, and it’s no secret this military has been demoralized under his leadership.

I would hope that our military is as ethical as you seem to think it is, but I used to think that the IRS wouldn’t be used as a weapon by the government, to go after it’s political enemies, either.

Yeah, it’s that TELLING and the manner in which you have done it (I said it, that’s it) that keeps me looking for the truth.

PD, see RWNJ’s response below the one I quoted…

It really all boils down to keeping faith with the constitution, doesn’t it?

[quote=“Cruella, post:111, topic:46639”]
Sheesh? I NEVER said they were out to get anybody. What I’m trying to understand is why such an apparently large operation is only using 1200 participants. And I see absolutely no reason why we the people can’t question this Administration. You keep saying it’s the military, but last I heard, Obama is the commander in chief of that military, and the Secretary of Defense, who I assume is on board with this, is his cabinet pick, and serves at his pleasure.

Obama has removed an alarming number of top military commanders and replaced them with others, that I assume are more to his liking, and it’s no secret this military has been demoralized under his leadership.

I would hope that our military is as ethical as you seem to think it is, but I used to think that the IRS wouldn’t be used as a weapon by the government, to go after it’s political enemies, either.
[/quote] Cruella, look into what types of units are participating in Jade Helm. That should explain it… Jade Helm is almost (as near as I can tell it is entirely, but I’m not privy to all the documents, so I’ll limit it to almost) entirely Special Forces… That means that (likely) a majority of the SF groups that aren’t on active missions or on stand-by for missions are involved. This isn’t (as some are portraying it) a ‘all hands Military’ exercise.

Carpenter, are you Russian? You remind me of the Russian General in the Darkened Sky series by John Ringo, who constantly had to be told the truth and still wouldn’t believe it (course, unlike you he ‘committed suicide’ by ‘shooting himself’ in the back 23 times. Don’t think your in danger of that and honestly, if nothing else, I find your posts on the subject a good laugh)

As for the ‘conspiracy theories’ regarding Jade Helm, lets break them down…
Conspiracy Theory 1 (I will start to call the CT for short, not a reference to CT the person that posts in the forums…): that the ‘conservative states’ are the hostile states. This ‘means’ that Obama is trying to take over by force. Truth: Based on a map which actually has the countries they are being compared to that is NOT entirely the case. First off, Southern California (Calexico area and southern parts of LA) are NOT by any means conservative, but they are considered hostile (insurgent territory). Second off, compare the relative sizes of the states to the relative sizes of the countries and add in climate similarities. Texas (which is primarily desert) is ‘Iran’ in Jade Helm. Iran is one of the biggest countries of those portrayed in Jade Helm. (The Countries are Lebanon, Iraq, Jordan, Iran, Israel, Turkey, Syria, and Palestine). Out of those countries, which one would YOU say is the best match for Texas as far as relative size and climate? Most of California is Israel (fairly similar shapes and variety of climates between the two), while Southern California is Palestine (desert and small for both…)

CT 2) This is an OBVIOUS attempt by Obama to use the military to take over the US by force and install himself as dictator. Truth: With 1200 participants?!? Are the people thinking Jade Helm is an attempt by Obama to install himself as dictator crazy, stupid, or both? US Special Forces may be good, but they aren’t good enough that they could take over the entire US with only 1200 people. Heck, they probably couldn’t even take over California with 1200 people.

CT 3) Obama has been removing Generals (and Admirals) and replacing them with those who support him and will let/help him take over. Truth: While part of that may be true (I don’t entirely trust Obama, but I do trust the Military), even if his intention is to try to replace them with people that would let him or help him take over, I don’t see many (if any) actually doing so. You don’t make it to General in less than 8 years (outside of special circumstances that haven’t existed in decades…) and if there is one thing Generals/Admirals/ANY senior Officer is good at, its playing politics to get promoted while remaining true to the principals of the Military. In fact, with the UCMJ the way it is, I doubt Obama could honestly know if the Generals support or oppose him. Even when someone in the Military thinks their superior (up to, including, and especially the President) is a blithering idiot (Obama for one…) they are forbidden to say it, show it, or in any definable way communicate it to the media, their troops, or pretty much ANYONE (Spouses/family are of course the exception to that rule… UCMJ doesn’t block military from expressing feelings to family, EXCEPT when something is classified…), so honestly being able to tell who supports him and who doesn’t isn’t really possibly, since even if they oppose him they are basically required to obey orders PROVIDED those orders aren’t in violation of the law or US Constitution.

This is the truth you are looking for… Having read your past posts, you probably ignore it and continue looking for the truth until after Jade Helm is complete and nothing has happened, at which time you’ll FINALLY accept the truth…

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You did real good until you got to your Put-down…the last paragraph. Would you care to explain why that was NECESSARY? That looks exactly how others post, and it comes real close to nullifying all your hard work up to that point.

But you’ve completely mischaracterized what he’s doing.

He isn’t asking questions, he throwing around aspersions, begetting the question as to whether they have betrayed their oaths, and simply assumes that they have. All without evidence.

If you have evidence of wrong doing or misconduct, fine, that is fair game. Accusations without evidence however is as I said, Satanic. The Ancients considered it among the worst possible things a person can commit, because accusations, even when they are unfounded, are difficult to live down if they gain enough traction.

That’s why libel is included in common law is a suable offense.

No one deserves to deal with that, least of all the people who sacrifice the most to keep this nation safe.

He may be wrong,

He is wrong, but not for the reason you’ve described. He’s wrong for accusing innocent people, questioning their honor, and all without a smoking gun. Because he can’t control himself. He’s doing this, because he’s hungry for a scandal to tear down this president with, and doesn’t care about the good people he’s tarnishing in the process.

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Fair point, [MENTION=14567]Carpenter[/MENTION], especially if what Ranma wrote does have an impact on your thinking.

To answer your question, I think most of the time the folks who post these kinds of things fit the bill Ranma described in his last paragraph.

All accusations …in your…mind. The fact that you have expressed your…OPINION…does not make anything true that you have said.

Your estimation of your self and your knowledge far exceeds the possibilities.

I think the real question here is; are military counter insurgency exercises a normal practice in towns and cities with civilians in the U.S.?

If any have happened before, I’ve not been aware of them, until the last couple of years. As mentioned before, I have seen them done out in open terrain and at a “mock” town at the Marine base in Oceanside.

A couple of years ago, downtown Los Angeles had a military exercise with 2400 Marines from that base that lasted a couple of weeks.

Also, as a COIN operation, I believe these exercises are not strictly military, but also include state an local agencies, as a way to learn how to communicate with and integrate all the different government agencies.

It’s not an accusation, it’s what you’re doing by posting crap like this:

Why Are FEMA Domes Going Up Behind Texas Grade Schools!

Jade Helm Update: Why Are There United Nations Up-Armored HUMVEES In The U.S.?

Which equally are not asking questions, but making open-ended accusations.

One of your sources dispenses with the question mark entirely, and puts the accusation in the title:

Texas Under Siege: Military Trains To Overthrow State Govt

And I don’t care if you don’t realize that you’re doing it, that just means you didn’t think the implications through. Or read your own damn sources.