Bardiel, the 13th angel, attacks on this day


AMBIVALENCE occurs on this day.

With the reluctant Fourth Child aboard, Unit-03 goes berserk during its maiden test, causing a giant explosion that envelops the test site. Quickly reclassified as the thirteenth angel, Bardiel, the remaining three Eva units are set against him.

But the first two are taken by surprise, and are quickly dispatched by the possessed unit, leaving only one young boy and his Eva between humanity and its assured destruction. The Third Child and Unit-01.

He however refuses to fight, even after he himself is attacked; protesting that he knows someone is inside the Angel he faces.

Left with no other recourse, his unit is forced to fight by means of an artificial intelligence, and the boy watches as he crushes Bardiel, helpless to stop it.

Later, after the carnage is done, his despair grows when he finds out the pilot is someone he knew; a friend. No one had told him the identity of the pilot, until he saw for himself their bloody, dismembered body. With thoughts filled with grief & anger, he then turns his frustrations on the people who had forced him to fight…


What in the HECK was THAT???


Pappadave that is Neon Genesis Evangelion.

Produced in 1995, it takes place in 2015, so fans are celebrating that we are now coinciding with events of the series. My main forum site, Evageeks, is doing this by releasing website banners that commemorate events in the series that take place that same day.

Like this one of Bardiel (or EVA-03) an American made unit btw.

EVA-04, the other American made unit, “disappeared”. Along with a good chunk of Nevada desert:

Hence why “we” were eager to get rid of the red-eyed unit above. It ended up getting possessed in-transit to Tokyo.

Anyway, for me, the series represents clear evidence that God, indeed, has a sense of humor.

It’s also why hearing Handel’s Messiah makes me feel sad, and that I have about 20 different versions of Fly Me to the Moon (the show’s ending theme).


OK. NOW what the heck are you talking about???


Again, Neon Genesis Evangelion. It’s a TV show from 1995, and it’s… pretty awesome

The antagonists for (most) of the series are “angels”. They’re not actually messengers of God, but they do take their (assigned) names from the same Angelic Choir canon the Bible does (spelling can vary).

**Ramiel. Sachiel. Leliel. Ireul. Israfel, Sandalphon. Sahaquiel. Shamshel. Ariel. Matarial. Gaghiel. Armisael. Bardiel. Tabris. **

No Gabriel or Raphael. But there may be a Uriel in the Rebuild films.

Each angel in the Choir is some aspect of God’s power or of the Natural world (just as there’s an Angel of Death), and the name’s of the “angels” in the show (generally) reflects this.

Ramiel is the Angel of Thunder (so he’s loud & powerful), Matarial is the Angel of Rain (so he can rain acid), and Sahaqiel is the Angel of the Sky (so he falls from the sky as a living bomb).

BTW, here’s how EVA-03 was moved in transport:

It’s SYMBOLISM!!11!!!111!!!

In addition, a few of the Angels shoot eye-beams that create*** cross-shaped explosions***.

And some of the Rebuild Film versions of these explosions add rainbows. Because science.


Well no wonder I didn’t know what it was. An old TV cartoon. I haven’t watched cartoon since I was a teen.


Pappadave , I think you got the wrong idea. While there’s a lot of fun, flashy, and even downright nerdy imagery, this isn’t a kid’s show. The creator would probably delight in knowing kids watched it, but it’d be more in the vein of “I want to break you” than anything, err… normal. If you watch this all the way through (it’s not even 5 minutes), you’ll see what I mean.

…Though even then, not really. This is a show the creator has received death threats for making. Threats he then put into the theatrical ending, as if to mock them.


Yet…it’s a CARTOON. I understand that animation has come a long way since Tom and Jerry, but I haven’t watched them since completing puberty, with one exception–I used to take my foster granddaughter or my Goddaughter to the movies when they were little to see Toy Story or Monsters, Inc. Usually I fell asleep at some point and they had to wake me.


From Japan Pappadave , which doesn’t see the same restrictions on tone for animation as we do in the West.

To them, you can put the like of murder, rape, & abuse into animated stories. They don’t bat an eye at that (though you can’t broadcast it at primetime).

For Evangelion’s part, it is to gore, body horror and violence what South Park is to cursing. The conclusion of the story, The End of Evangelion, is a " kill em all " ending where basically everyone dies, including a very violent death for one of its child pilots. You could even argue that the world itself is doomed in the story.


OK. It’s a JAPANESE cartoon. Big whoop! A cartoon is a cartoon, regardless of what country produces it.


No… the West has largely regulated animation to either kiddy faire (Disney, Dreamworks, Nickelodeon), or raunchy comedy (The Simpsons, Family Guy, South Park).

For some dumb reason, animation in America has a very hard time trying breaking this mold. And if they’re all you’ve watched, then you yourself Pappadave are likely approaching animation in one of these two ways, not as simply another medium to tell a story, like one would a book or live action films and television.


Oh, I LOVED comic books when I was a kid and traded them with my friends. Some of my favorites were “Weird Tales” which were not “raunchy” but quite graphic until the busy-bodies decided they were “bad” for kids to read. I liked cartoons, too. The neighborhood theater used to show them for a couple of HOURS every Saturday AM–before the features–and I’d sit through them two or three times. Disney, Warner Brothers, etc. produced some of the best of them. Bugs & Elmer, Mickey & Donald, Mighty Mouse, Little Audrey, Daffy Duck, Roadrunner vs Coyote, Woody Woodpecker, Foghorn Leghorn, Tom & Jerry were all favorites of mine and some were pretty violent–so here came the busy-bodies once again. Hanna-Barbara did some good stuff but the quality of their animation wasn’t very good. However, I gave all that cartoon stuff up when I passed puberty. JFTR, I don’t do video games either, which are just violent cartoons themselves.


Hey Pappa, I just turned 79 last month, but I still love these cartoons ----- if and when I can find them. Don’t care for the modern versions even when the characters and animation are same as the old ones; the newer versions just don’t have the “oomph” of the originals.


So why is it that live action is mature, and animation is for kids? Is a photographer more talented or sophisticated than someone who actually creates images from scratch? It isn’t the medium that matters; it’s what is done with it.

By the way, although I’ve heard of the series, I’ve never seen it. The anime I’ve seen includes Read or Die, Cowboy Beebop the Movie, Ghost in the Shell, Ghost in the Shell 2: Innocence, Appleseed, and among radically Americanized anime, Robotech, Sailor Moon, and (a little) Star Blazers.

By another way, we also have an anime sticky thread:

On edit: I see you already posted on it a while back, AS.


I used to watch cartoons when I would come home for lunch from school. Popeye, Yogi Bear, Rocky & Bullwinkle, and some very old Russian cartoons. Mickey Mouse and Bugs Bunny were always shown after school. I actually enjoyed some of the comics of TV. My favorites have always been Laurel & Hardy. They are the BEST. After them, I like Three Stooges, Martin & Lewis, Danny Kaye, and Jonathon Winters. There were more, but those are the ones I remember the most. I also loved serials such as Flash Gordon (with Buster Krabbe), Zorro, Ivanhoe (British), and Capt. Kangaroo. Of course, the Mickey Mouse Club was a given. I even had my Mickey Mouse ears with my name embroidered on it. It is true that cartoons today are boring and lacking in creativity. Also, the “funny papers” that my dad and I used to read together on Sundays is not fit for children anymore. It is sad what has happened to children’s entertainment.


Pappadave , you just proved my point.

You’re viewing cartoons through the way Americans have used it.

You think of animation as a genre, one for kids or dumb laughs, when it’s actually a medium. It can tell any kind of story.

JFTR, I don’t do video games either, which are just violent cartoons themselves.

It’s not simply “stylized violence” either Dave:

Grave of the Fireflies

This about a real life WWII survivor in Japan who lost both his father and his mother, and then his little sister post-war to malnutrition.

The movie is essentially his apology to his sister, whose death he feels responsible for. It’s also an outreach the young Japanese of the 1980s, who he felt didn’t understand what the war generation had gone through.


This is an anime about War Photography, of how journalists in war zones go about telling a story.

Ghost in the Shell

The inspiration for The Matrix, it explores transhumanism and widespread net technologies affects on humanity and society.