Brain-dead Democrats


#61

Obama is in the White House wreaking havoc, much of it irreversible, for yet another term and you, RET, in spite of all your rhetoric cannot get around the fact that when it really counted - at the ballot box during the general election - you chose to do nothing, nada, zilch to prevent it. And your justification: Romney and the GOP are “statists”, aka: socialists!!

I’m sure left-wing zealots/extremists/Democrats and Al Sharpton wannabes everywhere appreciate that.

Sometimes when confronted with what one justifiably considers less than optimal choices there is a time to cut your loses, minimize the damage and live to fight another day - to donate time/money directly to conservative candidates/causes and, as I recommended elsewhere in this thread, NOT through the RNC. Much of what is taking place at home and abroad under Obama will not be reversible in your lifetime or mine, if ever.

To claim Romney with a Repub congress would have been no different than Obama at the helm is, I think, absurd on its face.

I agree with you completely that we need a political party made up of real conservatives. But, abstaining from the general election ballot process and not doing what you can to defeat Obama, thus allowing him to continue the destruction does not ensure such a party is formed or, should it form, that there is anything left to govern. IMO


#62

And you claim to be over 60 years old? Somehow I have me doubts.


#63

No, you missed the point.

The “Conservative Movement” was never dead, when Conservatives have options to vote for those options have always won in big numbers; that is not something that started in 2010.

My comments have ALL been regarding how pointless it is for that Conservative army to keep pretending that the GOP is an appropriate or profitable home for their support. 2010 and 2014 both prove that the power of the Conservative Movement is wasted if invested in the Republican Party.

I never said it was “good” at any former time in the GOP, the GOP hated the Reagan Revolution and they hated the Gingrich Revolution; I merely said that the last time Conservatism was advanced was under Gingrich.

The Establishment GOP fought both revolutions far more viciously than they have ever fought the Demoncrats, that is why they have spent so much time since then altering the Primary structures and delegate policies to prevent a repeat of Reagan and why they have used the Congressional seniority rules to block out the Conservatives who win Congressional seats from positions of influence in the Party.

Yes we can “change the future”, and that “change” will begin when Conservatives realize that THEY are the majority and that THEY can perpetuate a Conservative agenda ONLY when they stop trying to use the Republican Party as the vehicle for their loyalty.

The GOP is a Statist/Socialist Party at the most entrenched level, the longer Conservatives beat their head against that wall the longer it will be before a genuine solution can form.

No, what I said was that as long as the GOP is the entity that Conservatives are trusting their votes to there will be no “change” except more Statism/Socialism.

That is only half of my quote, I said:

[quote=RET423]
When Conservatives are mobilized the GOP wins, but when the GOP wins Conservatism does NOT “win”[/quote]
You define success as when the Republican Party gains power and influence, I define success as when Statism/Socialism loses power and influence; I fully get why you are optimistic but you are completely oblivious as to why I advocate for a new direction.


#64

Thanks, RET. You help. You really do. At least me, at any rate.

People have lost sight of the goal. They’ve lost sight of any fundamental values they may have had. They keep trying to tell us that really lousy candidates can start getting us back to the fundamental values of this country when those candidates don’t hold those values, themselves.

Yet, we are the ones who supposedly hate our country.


#65
  1. Kindly refrain from trying to drive a wedge between me (and others) and Cruella. I may disagree with her on the point, but she makes it easy to be respectful while doing so.
  2. You see nothing but a hyperbolic claptrap strawman of your own creating.
  3. Excuse you, but as we’ve pointed out clearly time and time again, Obama’s actions are not our responsibility. Only he is responsible for himself, and only those who voted for him or committed election fraud on his behalf have any culpability. Anything else is like trying to blame me because a hostage died when I refused to pay the ransom.
  4. And we’ll never have one of any consequence as long as there are enough people convinced voting for the R is the only thing they can do.
  5. Actually, it’s about opposing two enemies instead of one. And when it comes down to it, God doesn’t give an almighty hoot about who has the most votes; He’s got the absolute veto.
  1. This is a false premise.
  1. I’ll wear them with pride; those shoes don’t say Liberal or Liberal Lite on them.
  2. I’m tired of watching you ignore the fact that more of the same only gets us more of the same. As to RINO vs. Dem, I’ve pointed out more than once the analogy of the frog in the boiling pot of water; I don’t recall even once seeing you give a response of substance (if at all).
  1. Stop trying to hold us accountable for someone else’s bad choices like a tort lawyer does. I didn’t choose Obama. Not voting for Romney wasn’t choosing Obama.
  2. We know plenty about when it counts; we also know what counts.
  3. Hardly. Men of good conscience acting on conscience scare the tar out of them.
  4. To hear you tell it, that time is all the time. We don’t cut our losses by electing losers.
  5. Beat that drum all you like; it’s still false. Doing a write-in is NOT abstaining from the general election. It’s only abstaining from the two paths off the cliff (one of them longer) that the two parties are trying to force us down.
  1. False.
  2. False. As I stated in another post (in this thread or another), actually casting a ballot for a genuine conservative sends a message to the GOP: Give us a candidate we can stomach voting for, or go bark at the moon.
  3. Hogwash. Conscience is more than a “feeling.” If you value it so little, it would explain why you seem to subscribe voting for whoever has the R in the general election.
  4. It’s no mind game; the only one of those being played is by those who would have us sell a smaller piece of our soul for the next Boehner or McConnell.
  1. She said nothing about which she needs to do so. You are trying to demean her because she vigorously challenges your position.
  2. Actually, some of your comments are getting close to insult territory. Learn to disagree a little more respectfully, and you’ll get along better here.
  1. The only point of significance that anyone missed is that GOP fought the Tea Party movement in some venues, and coopted it in others (running RINOs on a Tea Party platform, which I seem to recall they were successful at in some cases).
  2. Repeating it doesn’t make it true.

#66

Right. And we believe every word you say, although you said otherwise elsewhere.

Tell us, please, just what exactly about McCain was positive.
His McCain/Feingold act?
His going against his own state’s governor when it came to illegal immigration?
His participation in the “Gang of Eight?”

Just WHAT, exactly, did he have to offer the United States as a president?

Same questions for Romney. Just WHAT, exactly did he have to offer as a candidate?

“Not the other guy” is not an answer.


#67

Agreed. I’ve long thought that conservatives still had a chance to return the GOP to its founding principles. I’ve come to understand that as long as the “progressives” are in charge of the Party, that’s a faint hope at best. Democrats are a lost cause–and have been for a long time–but I thought the GOP could still be saved from itself. Apparently not.


#68

Takes real intellect…I will follow your lead…false, false, false, false…to everything you said…now, two can play that simple game!


#69

You are wrong on all counts I disliked McCain, still do! I disliked Romney, still do! But that both beat the heck out of Obama…and if we could get blank thinkers like you to show up and vote for the GOP regardless! We can turn this thing around, but you all talk a lot, but none of you have a better plan…3rd Party, been tried failed miserably, not voting to prove some kinda point, again been tried, failed again! I agree that another RINO will kill us, but you do not stop that by voting for a Dem or not voting or voting 3rd Party…that is just nutty thinking…you all have gone mad!


#70

STOP! Stop right sinking now! I’m tired to pieces of you putting words in my mouth, claiming I said what I didn’t, claiming I did what I did not.

Isn’t DU missing you by now? Aren’t you done having your fun, yet?

(Well, if he can do it, so can I. Thing is, I have an uncanny sense for discerning those who are sincere from those who are not. AKA a “BS meter.” Sue me if you don’t like it.)


#71

I believe you have something there, 2cent. I’ve seen blatant leftist who haven’t stirred the pot any worse than this.


#72

You condemn the idea of forming a Conservative Party as a bad plan while endorsing the “plan” that has been an abject failure at reversing the destructive trajectory of this Nation for the last 5 or 6 decades.

Nobody has tried to form a political party based on the most popular philosophy amongst the citizens since the Republican Party split from the Democrat/Republican Party prior to the Civil War, that certainly “worked out”.

Now cite your strategy’s success story, find a political party that embraced Statism/Socialism that was successfully reformed from within into a Party that embraced Constitutional Conservatism.

Fair warning, that is a challenge that I already know the only possible response; I just listed it because your “blank thinker” accusation was childish and incorrect so I am exposing who is the one who has not thought this topic through.

You are advocating voting for a RINO while admitting that doing so will “kill us”, then you claim that anyone who does not embrace your strategy is a “Nutty Thinker who has gone Mad”?

Defending the hypocrisy of the Establishment GOP is destructive to critical thinking skills, the only cure is complete abstinence.


#73

Suz, they’re as transparent as the day is long. You’d think some of them would realize when they’ve had their hat handed to them.


#74

Yeah, too bad that’s a false representation of what I did, as anyone who took more than a glance at my mile-long post can tell you. I responded to specific points, and several of them with more than “false false false.” The real issue is that you ran out of any meaningful ammunition after the first volley or two of this argument.

How is more of the same going to turn things around? And you accuse us of nutty thinking?


#75

What was that about the definition of insanity being doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results? That’s what many of us have had our eyes opened to about electing RINO’s. That’s why we won’t participate in it any more. When we elected conservatives, we got more of what we were looking for. So we keep trying to elect true conservatives, knowing that if/when we succeed, we will get results that we are pleased with.


#76

RET423…Actually, you are wrong…a Conservative Party has been tried…and it has been in front of you all along! we call it the Tea Party…and it has done very well in changing the mix of Conservatives within the State Houses around this country and also in the Congress, both houses…

But, to many of you are wanting some overnight magic bullet! LISTEN, it took us over 50 years to screw up this country letting a bunch of Social Progressive Elitists, first take over the Democratic Party, and then letting them take over Congress and the Presidency and dang near the Supreme Court! One more Democratic President and they will own that also!

We cannot fix 50+ years of this craziness without a few long years of struggle. The struggle really started in 2010, we had other periods of good Conservative work in Congress and the Presidency…but true Conservatism was not defined until 2010 by a large group of active voters. That wave continues, and their goal is not a 3rd party, but control of the GOP, that is the shortest way home! We currently have 87 Conservatives working in Congress! Prior to 2010 you could not define as many as 10! Now that is progress in the RIGHT direction. Join the fight, stay on track! Going off on your own will only weaken the fight that is already underway!


#77

That’s right, Suz. One by one, we’re beginning to make headway with 'Out w/the old, and in with the new.'
We knew from the start that it wouldn’t be an overnight success, AND that nobody’s perfect, (lol), but with guys like Mike Lee, Tom Cotton, Ted Cruz, Jeff Sessions, Scott Walker, and yes, even Rand Paul, we’re beginning to see a wee light at the end of the tunnel.
Are there let-downs? Well shucks - I bet I let my own husband down from time to time. None of us is going to make each other happy ALL of the time. It’s not possible.
Doesn’t mean we give up on each other, though, and I’m not going to give up on our country.

While realizing there’s some harsh realities to be faced, I will not buy into all the doom and gloom. To me, that’s a self-fulfilling prophesy, and not a very good plan.


#78

The “Tea Party” is not a political party. It is a bunch of conservatives trying to work within the Republican party. There seemed to be some response in the election, but many of those who ran with a platform agreeing with the tea party reneged as soon as they took office.


#79

Fantasy Chaser

So you simply deny that the GOP has a number of new Conservatives since 2010-2014? Then look further to the make up of the State Legislators since 2010…loaded up with Conservative GOP’ers! The big revolution you all think you want is underway already. You are a generation that wants fast fixes! Sorry, took over 50 years to get the screwed up, will take some time to fix it!

Stop chasing Fantasies, and get involved in what is already happening!


#80

I guess some people were absent during the 90’s so missed how successful the “Contract with America” was.