Coronavirus: Illegal Aliens Demand $1.2K Each in Taxpayer-Funded Checks

The 1st post in the thread, by silliessis, said this:

“million illegal aliens living in the United States — are pleading with the federal government to cut federal checks to illegal aliens who have Individual Tax Identification Number (ITINs).

So either you didn’t read it, or you’re playing game.

Yes it is.

Grover Norquist, once again:

Same position, same points as mine.

You failed to call his position open borders, which tells me, that’s just a ****** debate tactic on your part.

Because you don’t know how to discuss any issue you have an emotional stake in, whether it be guns, abortion, or this.

You just get emotional, and self-righteous. You follow the same pattern of accusations each time those issues come up.

I mentioned guest worker programs when I first got here in 2014. And Everyone here remembers me hitting on Bracero like a drum. You’re the only one in this forum who doesn’t.

I have news for you; you look like a liar.

A simple word search of my posts verifies I’m right.

Bracero, guest worker, sick, and terrorists all show up. In posts I made in 2014 and 2015. Along with years following.

So you’re debunked.

The record doesn’t lie, but you were “too busy” I guess to check.

Because I’m right.

I check in with economists, that why I know this:

"This near unanimity of opinion among economists as to the economic effect of immigration is worth emphasizing. Even George Borjas, the most prominent economist advocating restrictions on immigration agrees that immigration increases the wealth of the United States. "

And see, this your other problem Send.

You don’t test your assumptions.

It was a Republican comptroller report out of Texas from 2006, which first showed me
that the economic impact is 11x the services.

You are more than welcome to read it.

Yes we do. Our labor markets are not unified, and more rural areas go through shortages while urban areas have labor gluts.

Migrant labor, legal and illegal, help to alleviate the shortages, which help to create jobs in the areas with high unemployment.

As a George Mason University economist put it “they’re oil which greases the wheels of the economy”.

Yes, you are insincere.

You make claims about my posts that a word search shows you’re wrong about.

So long as you continue to do this, you are insincere.

It’s not about you conveying your position, it’s your inability to properly represent mine.
If you can’t help but lie about what I’ve said, then you admit that you weren’t interested in talking.

I didn’t lie about your positions. You can’t seem to manage to show me the same courtesy.

If they have an ITIN they are not here illegally, if they are here illegally they are working under the table or they are using stolen SS numbers.

And not one single prominent economist says that the wealth of the United States is increased by importing illegal welfare rats who work under the table tax free.

Which you know because I have told you this numerous times whenever you quote someone on the benefits of IMMIGRATION while you are defending ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION.

Over and over and over again :rofl:

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Well I certainly got your panties in a wad, didn’t I AS?

You still didn’t address the issue of illegal alien criminal deportation. Are they also part of the “unskilled labor force that is essential to our economy?” I guess they are since you refuse the to address the issue. Maybe you will come back and say, “I addressed that issue 2016 and you are a liar and insincere for bring it up now.”

It never ceases to amaze me how you use previous citations to support your positions. You never can state quite simply, “This is my position,” and state it. It’s always, “This is I what said in 2014, and you are a liar because you haven’t gone back to read it.” Simply stating what you believe is so much simpler, but that’s not what you do. You play this game because most here would find your policies unacceptable if you were forthright about them.

Well, at any rate, you do have a lot of liberal supporters, and they usually use their claims of intellectual superiority to buttress their policy. When you cut through to vines, which are very similar to the ones you create, you find this simple truth. The Democrat Party supports tearing down borders because they need these new citizens and non-citizens to vote Democrat and keep them in power. It’s just that simple.

The Democrats don’t give a damn about these people, and they could care less about your economic theories. It’s a power grab.

If Democrats get what they want, nothing your precious Grover Norquest has to say about lower taxes will mean a thing. The Democrats will get their disastrous socialist system up and running and your immigrants will flock to our borders in droves to get something for nothing. It will take a while, but in a bit of time the U.S. will become the new Venezuela.

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There is no residency test for ITINs. Illegals get them at will.

I’ve brought this up before. Several times.

Stephen Goss – the SSA head actuary who said 2/3 of illegals pay FICA taxes. Any of this ringing a bell?

ITINs are why he says it.

He SAYS this or he SAYS that means NOTHING, AS. He bases his “2/3rds” claim on the outmoded, outdated “estimates” that there are only 10-11 million illegals in the country. The whole COUNTRY knows those numbers are 'WAY low in reality and the ACTUAL numbers are more than TWICE that amount, which makes your vaunted “2/3rds” more like 1/6th which gives us from 13 to 23 MILLION illegals living off of the rest of us.

Yes I did. Done so several times.

The government is free to capture and deport criminals.
I’ve stated this before, and you, Send, acknowledged I did.

You claimed I never brought up Guest worker programs before you probed me.

You said that. Which makes my referencing my old posts evidence that your claim is false.

The next words you say here must be “Okay, I admit I was wrong”, or you admit this is just a show.
That you are, once again, posturing.

I’m not playing a game.

You are playing a game. You have lied about what I’ve said. I have never done that to you.

And as to my views being “unacceptable”, why would I care?

I quote economists and Conservatives with my viewpoint, I offer up analysis for why I’ve staked positions I have. Analysis is what I care about.

You have never done the same. Not once have I ever seen you offer any analysis on this issue.

Even if I asked you “can you show me one study, showing the economic impact of illegal aliens on GDP?”

I don’t believe you could do that. I think you’ve been too busy thinking of votes, to ask what the economic impact has been.

Then why are Republicans proposing it and Democrats voting it down?


Any explanation?

It means illegals are paying into the system at over $10 billion a year.

The money wouldn’t be there in those accounts if they weren’t.

As discussed before, we can back-estimate how many there are, by how many services and products they’re buying.

Even an extra 3-4 million, cannot hide their consumption. Neither of Government services, nor the economy.

It’s just not possible to hide it.

And it has been BS all of those times as well, you quote a wild guess about excess tax revenues from a government that cannot account for huge amounts of spending and revenues as standard operation.

And there is no residency or citizenship test for Welfare either but you VEHEMENTLY deny that illegals use that loophole but you have no problem believing they use the same loophole to PAY TAXES ILLEGALLY.

AS always your own words condemn your argument.

You have never quoted a single conservative economist that supports your opinion that importing welfare rats who cheat the tax system under the table enriches the United States.

Not once, not ever, because they don’t exist.

This is so ludicrous that I should be shocked that anyone would utter such nonsense out loud, but I am not shocked when you keep saying this because I have come to realize that Liberals are so far removed from reality that they honestly do not know how insane they sound when they say why they believe what they believe out loud :rofl:

So you made a mistake.

ITINs are what I said they were; the Heritage Foundation hates them for the very reason that they can be used like this.

Nope, it’s a formalized report RET. The SS trustees report formally calculates that the trust will last longer the more immigrants (both legal and illegal) we get, and less the less of them we get.

And as I said; that illegals pay taxes cannot be denied.

Because the accounts with the money they contribute exists.
To the tune of >$13 Billion a year.

There is no “guessing” they have to do to point that out.

You can look this up and verify what I’ve said here.

I’ll wait.

Yet everything I said was correct. Once again, you faulted me for saying something that was true.

At some point, character has to come into question here. You can’t complain about me pointing out details you don’t like RET. That’s just petty.

It’s not my fault this system exists and operates this way. I didn’t make this.

Want to know something else RET?

The IRS knows where many of these people are thanks to ITINs; they’re just not allowed to share that information with INS.

Federal Government is a gloriously perplexing thing.

I have quoted economists, and A Republican Texas Comptroller, saying illegals contribute net
economic benefit to our economy.

I have done that.

And I can name drop economists from AEI, to the Hoover Institute, to the Mercatus Center, who all do this.

Garbage response

Yes, I’m sure you did some time between 2014 and 2020.

Since you have so much trouble formulating answers to the issues, here are two samples for you:

“Yes I believe that convicted criminal aliens should be deported in the interest of public safety.”

or

“No, I don’t support deporting them because they service a useful function in our communities.”

or perhaps you have some other thoughts on the subject. It’s obvious that you avoid sharing them whenever possible.

Do you support sanctuary cities?

I know you will tell me that you have answered that sometime between 2014 and 2020. Therefore that gives you license not to answer the question.

For the record I support guest worker programs so long as we keep tabs on them. I don’t support letting them come here and melt into the economy. All immigrates need to go though an orderly process so that the undesirable people, the criminals, drug traffickers and most especially gang members, like MS-13, are kept out of the country.

Now there is a straight, honest answer.

Now come back and call me a liar.

Ditto.

? I answered this in that post you just responded to:
The government is free to capture and deport criminals.

Did you just, miss this?

Yes; they have better law enforcement outcomes. Police have known that for decades.

Police can’t do their job without establishing ties to communities, and you can’t establish ties if they’re just afraid of you.

But even more than this, I support Federalism, and Sanctuary cities are a feature of that.
Even if I didn’t agree with the policy, I’d be on the side of saying cities have the right to be one.

Sure, I could support that, there’s nothing wrong I see there.

Just so long as you’re not rejecting people based on skills.

The Government has no business deciding which skills are useful. It doesn’t know.
Bureaucrats, don’t know what the economy needs.

Ah, geez! I get a headache from all this. Look, the bottom line is that illegals should not be rewarded for their breaking the United States’ laws. Once they step over the border, regardless of where they’re from, they have broken the law. They should not be rewarded by giving them taxpayer’s monies, free food, or whatever else the dems think is helping them. But, look on the bright side: the COVID-19 may put a stop to illegals.

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In this case, it’s their own money.

They’re talking about illegals who pay taxes through ITINs. They’re saying that they these tax-paying illegals should get the same refund everyone else.

AS: If they are illegal, how do they pay taxes? If I remember correctly, in order to pay taxes, one must have a SS number.

ITINs, independent tax identification Numbers. They’ve been around since 1996.

No, they will get sick. We will have to spread more on the disease to take care of them. And they will clog up our health care system, which already over burdened. If there has even been a time for shutting down the border, this is it. Canada has done it. Why can’t we?

I’d agree IF what you claim was, in fact, true. It’s not. In Mexico alone, we know that “renditions” from Mexicans here illegally amount to Mexico’s LARGEST revenue source next to oil sales. That means that illegal Mexicans alone, coupled with what you claim illegals are paying illegally in INCOME taxes, amounts to over TWICE that claim. It’s demonstrably BS because illegals HERE are not living on nothing.