Dealing with illegals aliens already here


#1

Most conservatives seem to agree that we need to secure the border and fix our legal immigration system. The point of contention arises when it comes to dealing with illegals already residing in the U.S.

There seem to be three opinions on what to do with those already here…

  1. Deport them all. This is the ideal scenario in my view. The problem is that it is the least likely to happen, because of the political opposition to doing it as well as the severe political backlash that would result if it was implemented. There would be social consequences (ripping apart families because of “anchor babies”) and economic consequences to this. The methods by which this would be carried out effectively would also be questionable-how do you just round up millions of Mexicans without violating the rights of legitimate citizens? In reality, this just isn’t going to happen, even if it should. It should have been done years ago when the problem wasn’t so large.

  2. Make them citizens. Unfortunately, this is a very likely scenario. And with it comes many problems. First of all, with citizenship comes the right to vote. Second, it entitles you to be eligible for government programs and welfare. Considering the demographics of the illegals, those two factors combined would be absolutely devastating to the country.

  3. Let them stay under a legal status. Newt Gingrich caught a lot of heat for proposing this during his presidential campaign. It’s the position Rand Paul has taken ahead of his. This is not the ideal scenario, but it does sidestep the consequences of mass deportation as well as the problems arising from giving illegals citizenship. This option may be gaining support, but its proponents are having a hard time selling it to those who won’t accept any form of “amnesty.” This is the route I would take going forward; it just needs some branding improvement.

I’m going to set up a poll gauging whether people here support options 1, 2, or 3. Of course, feel free to advocate and dissect the options I presented. Perhaps there is another option I left out.


#2

#1 is impossible, #2 is irresponsible, so #3 is the least bad scenario.


#3

Your poll is not valid if you limit it to what you have.

It seems to favor (2 to 1) the Illegals.

First off … The Immigration Laws Do Not need fixing!
The laws that are there are not being ‘enforced’!

Too … You left out one scenario: Self Deportation!

Enforce the law against hiring Illegal Aliens.

No Welfare which means No Foodstamps, Housing, Free Healthcare etc. etc.

Jail and deport gang members and their families.

All of this would depend on the first step: Enforce Existing Laws!


#4

So you think that if existing laws were enforced (lets assume with the border being secured and the overstaying visa problem fixed) that we would be able to deport significant numbers of illegals?


#5

Did you ‘overlook’ my self deportation scenario?:confused:


#6

No, but why would anyone want to go back to Mexico? The place is a lawless mess, and even the underground economy here is better than the above ground economy there.


#7

First Illegal-alien, then Illegal-immigrant, now Undocumented-immigrant. Seems that they are no longer illegal, problem solved! Change, the only constant…

Amnesty? No, it too will change to Assylum!

Didn’t vote, options were too limited.


#8

It is a poll that would make a leftist or RINO proud in the way it is worded!
2 to 1 in favor of Illegals.

You see examples of it on all leftists polling sites and of course in … The New York Times.:banana:


#9

While I agree that self-deportation based on existing laws is not a workable solution, it is potentially a popular existing viewpoint and omitting it seems to be a flaw of your poll.


#10

It would work if we threaten to shoot them all. -----------nah polls be damned, CLOSE THE BORDER< DEPORT ALL AVAILABLE ILLEGALS< PROSECUTE ALL THOSE RESIST DEPORTATION> Now we can begin again to gain sanity in the immigration programs


#11

How do we fix it?

Do what Eisenhower did, he didn’t build a wall, he built a funnel. If illegals were found, they were simply brought to the border, asked to step over, and then step right back over as legal members of the Bracero program.

If illegals were found trying to cross the border, they were funneled into the Bracero program.

If they were accompanying legals already in the Bracero program, they were funneled into the Bracero Program.

…and Illegal immigration dropped by over 90%.

The truth is we don’t need to deal with the illegals already here. Fix the legal immigration system, prevent illegal immigration’s growth, and the illegal immigration population will shrink on its own. Due to them dying, “self deporting”, or leaving so as to take advantage of new legal avenues.


#12

If they were cut off from all public aid and the criminal element was sent back via trebuchet then those with no initiative would self deport and those with the American spirit would become self employed here and become a great asset to America.

In fact dismantling the Welfare State for everyone would probably correct all of our issues, once the only viable option to survive is productive work the Pro business political agenda will become very popular.

With no Welfare State there is no reason to limit immigration


#13

Couldn’t agree more.

With no Welfare State there is no reason to limit immigration

^This right here is all I was trying to get you to admit. Our true enemy is not immigration, it’s welfare. Instead of “border security”, we should be dismantling Welfare, or at least drawing a caveat around immigrants from receiving it.


#14

“Get him to admit”!!! Ret’s been beating that drum on this forum for… near 8 years now!


#15

^ Yet, he fought me tooth and nail, maintaining that we should “build a fence” instead of just doing this.


#16

He literally read my first post in this thread that made that case and took issue with it for pages, he is just a Liberal trying to bait Conservatives, I am ashamed that it took me so long to decide that.


#17

Here is the correct order of operations,

1.) Build boarder fence and increase security and drone activity.

2.) Complete overhaul of 100% of the immigration system including deportation and integration and employment verification. Make it easier and much faster to become a citizen of the USA. Improve the Visa system and deport the millions here who shouldn’t be here with expired visas. Deport ANY illegal immigrant with a criminal history. Period.

3.) Go through a second round of welfare reform like we did in the 90’s with Speaker Gingrich.

Reform of immigration will solve over 50% of the welfare problems we have in this country. If you are here illegally you can’t get it and if you force everybody currently on it to get verified all over gain once a year by providing documentation of citizenship and they don’t have it they don’t get it, and you report them to ICE who should have an office in every welfare building.


#18

Judge Napolitano says the same as I do, are you calling him a liberal now?

The fact is, there’s a difference between you and I, in that I see less allowable exceptions to liberty, and you see more.


#19

… So we have a problem with immigration, and you want to fix it, with a Big Government solution?

I don’t see the appeal quite frankly.

2.) Complete overhaul of 100% of the immigration system including deportation and integration and employment verification.

Employers aren’t responsible for verifying Government policy. E-verify also, is in fact, unconstitutional. The Government does not have the power to allow or disallow my work. That is between me and my employer.

Make it easier and much faster to become a citizen of the USA. Improve the Visa system and deport the millions here who shouldn’t be here with expired visas.

Better idea: streamline the process for them to renew said visas. This way, Government policy isn’t getting in the way of either economic activity, nor natural human action.

Like it’s supposed to.

You cannot plan populations from the top down, and the Government shouldn’t be doing it anyway. It can measure immigration, attach conditions, but it cannot dictate, only facilitate.


#20

Government can most certainly dictate who can stay in this country if they are here illegally. A boarder fence is a matter of national security, because we were attacked and are still highly at risk of being attacked and since its much harder for them to do it via airplane they will do it through our boarders. Think of it as we are pulling out of the middle east and using our resources to protect our country by protecting our boarder. A Government without question has that right.

Every employment job I ever applied to and gotten I was asked for my license and SS card. It’s common sense for an employer to ask for proof of citizenship. What I’m suggesting is that the Government improve the way they determine who’s here illegally by preventing ss card fraud and fraud at the DMV. The rest will self correct. Again common sense.

Streamlining visas is getting in the way and it involves Government verification via acceptance or denial. I don’t know what you are talking about. Your ok with this, but not securing our boarder, because of the Feds involvement? Can’t have it both ways.