Easy and good trade war must be working out -- Good job, guys!


#81

It’s black & white.

The claim is that what these people are doing is illegal.

That’s false, because what there doing is applying for asylum. No differently than others have done it.

No one can point out what these people have done that is different than drifting Cubans or Venezuelans.

You might be angry about it, but with no rationale or logic for why. Likely because you’re displacing the anger you have on Mexican immigration from 12-15 years ago onto the current situation, even though they’re completely different.

This idiocy suggesting the border rush is just some sort of protest of Trump… if someone just spent 5 minutes looking into what was going on in the countries these people are coming from, you’d know that’s not only wrong, it’s a non-sequitur.

Internalizing dumb, conspiracy-theory-esce explanations for events affecting millions of people… is our collective sense-making truly that dead?


#82

More BS from AS! Your numbers were made up out of whole cloth and you know it. Well over 80% are seen to be bogus claims for “asylum”. These aren’t “refugees” OR “asylees”, whatever that means. They are coming here on the promises of the left that they’ll be admitted without question and allowed to attach to the government teat, and all that will be asked of them in return is that they support the Democrats once here.


#83

The Cubans emptied their prisons and sent us all of their criminals. Were you ASLEEP during the Mariel Boat Lift?


#84

The ones not crossing at a port of entry are committing a criminal act PERIOD

There is no emergency which requires them to flee Mexico under duress. Any supposed persecution they are fleeing is thousands of miles away in El Salvador, Syria or the Congo.

The Cubans fled true oppression in a dangerous journey in small boats without GPS. They landed at their first safe opportunity.

:vb-headbang:


#85

Since they’re surrendering themselves to border authorities as soon as they cross, they’re following the law.

You can’t deny this OD, I just quoted how USCIS looks at this. They could wait to surrender themselves up to a year and still be doing things legally.

Since they’re doing it immediately, there’s no question.

Again OD, I think you’re doing exactly what I said. Displaced anger over Mexican immigration from 12 years back, when this situation is different. Illegal immigrants don’t surrender themselves, these people did.

What’s more, those Mexicans were mostly working age males, these people are mostly families looking for safety.

Their numbers are overwhelming, because we shut down the refugee program. Asylees and refugees are now one group. Whereas before we’d get the refugee portion in stages, were now getting nigh all them all at once. This is the consequence of our policy changing at a time when people needed the refugee program more than ever.

Yes there is, Mexico is filled with criminal groups who pick them apart, and Mexico doesn’t care or respond.
Equally, those people can already have family here, so it doesn’t make sense for them to stay in Mexico.

Nonetheless, most do end up staying in Mexico.

They aimed for the U.S. because this is where the largest Cuban-exile community exists. It’s 10x bigger than Puerto Rico’s, which is right next door. No difference.

This is me; you’re not forthcoming about the Cubans, and you’re off about the legality of this.

If you want to claim people are taking advantage of the process, fine, but it’s still legal. And considering the acceptance rate is above 80%, seems to me most of their stories aren’t so fake.

https://www.univision.com/univision-news/immigration/more-than-90-of-migrants-from-the-first-central-american-caravan-passed-asylum-interview


#86

The “acceptance rate” is FAR from 80%, AS. Why won’t you acknowledge this?


#87

I just offered a source, so you’re the one who is off. Didn’t make up the number, didn’t make up the claim, I simply re-reported what the Government did. Be honest about this Dave.

You may be confusing general acceptance rate of refugees from what the rate has been for members from these caravans specifically.


#88

I for one am going to be doubtful that they ever meaningfully work out their human rights issues. They simply see themselves apart from the rest of the world, and since they are an economic superpower that other countries are dependent on, they don’t really see much reason to change.


#89

We’ve been TALKING about the phony “refugees” from these caravans and you’ve now switched to talking about real refugees? Make up your mind.


#90

I’am talking about the caravans.

Most of the refugees from these caravans are accepted as real. The link I just gave you says 93%, as reported by USCIS for a caravan that arrived last year.

The general acceptance rate is lower.


#91

Nonsense! 93% of them never show up for an adjudication hearing. They’re just kept for 20 days and turned loose on the rest of us.


#92

He knows that, he also knows the vast majority of the criminals invading are not “surrendering” or even come close to a border official.

It is not facts that he lacks, it is intellectual integrity in debating caused by holding an agenda that he knows he cannot admit to without alienating all but the extreme left.


#93

Univision carefully selects one group, ignores all of those in the group who never bothered to be interviewed, then declares a number that supports their fake news agenda.

I can see why you trust them, you both read the same manual.


#94

The source is USCIS, how about you look at it? It’s listed right there in the article.


#95

They are surrendering, this is why there is a crisis. USCIS doesn’t have beds for everyone surrendering to them. They’re overwhelmed.

This has been the situation on the ground for months RET. Did you honestly not know?


#96

Which also states “USCIS clarifies, however, that “credible fear totals should NOT be confused with the total number of caravaners,” as it did not have raw data on the numbers of members of the caravan who were not refered to USCIS for a credible fear interview.” (emphasis mine)

Kind of an important caveat, there, wouldn’t you say? Why, if one didn’t know better, one might think that those numbers were deliberately presented in a misleading way. How many caravaners avoided any official interaction? How many were screened out and sent back before referral to USCIS?

Uh, a credible fear referral is NOT acceptance for asylum, it merely gets a hearing from an immigration judge. And that’s all those numbers are, the ones that USCIS has kicked over to an immigration judge for a hearing.

Nice try at framing the narrative. Here, let me try: https://ijr.com/dhs-secretary-whopping-percentage-migrants-dont-show-hearing/


#97

He knows all of that as well, but the whole truth condemns his position and confirms that Trump is absolutely right in his assessment of this as a crisis and an invasion; so most of the facts will simply be ignored by the Left.


#98

Thank you for reading it. RET was quick to dismiss it, too quick apparently.

Yes, I admit, my wording was making a conflation there I hadn’t meant to. By saying “legitimate claim”, I wasn’t trying to say they had earned asylum, only that they were passing the first bar in the process.

I’m not framing the narrative. At first I was pointing out the legality of how people apply for asylum, then I was responding to accusations, directed at me.

Accusations that should never have been made. I made nothing up, at worst I was imprecise, and it’s because I was rushing.

Last thing I’ll point out:

  1. Crossing the border and surrendering to agents is legal. Nothing mentioned here has changed that.

  2. Most asylees show up for their interview. The DHS secretary was talking about a pilot program of only 7,000; the larger numbers is something you can see here.

As I said before:

So I covered my bases. I stated upfront what I didn’t know, and I acknowledged what part of this is in fact illegal.


#99

I’m not holding my breath, but I don’t believe they’re as economically invulnerable as you think. I believe they need the world as a market far more than the world needs them as a supplier. And their own citizens are growing restless at the state of their economy. They can crack down, but I believe that’ll only make their economy worse in the end.


#100

Really? It sure looked like you were trying to conflate the percentage of the subset of migrants referred to cis for a pre-hearing credible fear review (guess who probably gets refered? The ones most likely to be approved) who then showed up for their hearings with the percentage of all migrants who show up for their hearings, while also ignoring those who don’t make the cut , cut and run, or evade interactions with authorities entirely.

Lies, d***** lies, and statistics. Statistics can be made to appear to say d*** near anything if you pick the ‘right’ metrics to put in your report.