FoxNews punishes Lt. Gen. Thomas McInerney for daring to tell the truth


#21

And you immediately entered the topic by mixing apples and oranges in an attempt to take the spotlight of McCain, who broke under torture and made a propaganda recording used by the Viet Cong.

You wrote:

“No, that argument doesn’t work.
Forcing someone to be a propaganda piece, and gaining useful, actionable Intel through torture, are two different things.
If you want to make a case for torture, making a misleading argument isn’t the way to do it. It just looks like you’re trying to hide something.”

The bottom line is, without mixing apples and oranges, Lt. Gen. Thomas McInerney stated a fact when he said on FoxNews “It [torture] worked on John [McCain]. That’s why they call him ‘Songbird John’”

So, why did FoxNews decide to ban him for stating a fact? Seems FoxNews has caved into our politically correct crowd, and that should make you very, very happy.

JWK


There was a time not too long ago in New York when the able-bodied were ashamed to accept home relief, a program created by Franklin D. Roosevelt in 1931 when he was Governor. Now, New York City and many other major cities are infested with countless government cheese factions, including recent abled bodied immigrants, who not only demand welfare, but use it to buy beer, wine, drugs, sex, and Lotto tickets.


#22

Turning John McCain into a propaganda piece is not “torture working”.

When people talk about it working, they mean, it generates intel we use to stop terrorist attacks.

Not the same thing, and you know that. Intel is the question, and precisely what people back in the Bush Era were referring to when they defended the policy.

No intel = not working.


#23

So somehow YOU know that McCain did NOT provide any intel to the North Vietnamese? Please tell us HOW you know this. I’m sure we all are waiting with bated breath for your wisdom.


#24

Why is John not presenting that story?

Why is he still sticking to the orange of propaganda use, when that’s not the same as the apple of intel, which is the entire point of legitimizing the Intense interrogation program?

Who here denies that if we did the same thing to our prisoners that the Vietnamese did to Mcain, that people would demand the program to end?

That this kind of “success” would harm, not boost the legitimacy of the program? Just like Abu Ghraib?

Is Abu Ghraib what we should consider success here? Because that too was propaganda meant to delegitimize & humiliate.


#25

Yes. “Propaganda meant to delegitimize and humiliate” AMERICANS overseeing that prison. Those men weren’t harmed…they certainly weren’t “tortured.” They were made to wear a dog leash and kneel naked with a pair of women’s panties on their heads. They were laughed at and taunted. It wasn’t any more harmful than a typical college fraternity hazing. They had alligator clamps attached to their genitals and THREATENED with electric shock. There was NEVER any evidence–or even testimony–that they WERE shocked. It was unnecessary and those responsible were punished for it, but it wasn’t “torture” any more than waterboarding is “torture.” I’ve BEEN waterboarded. It’s scary as hell, but it’s not “torture” which requires physical HARM…even if only temporary. The thousands of men and women waterboarded by the military services to show them what to expect and how to resist it are all living normal lives–totally UNharmed.


#26

Is that the success you want?

Because that’s the analog to forcing McCain into propaganda videos. Is that your criteria for success, or is it intel?


#27

Try to pay attention and keep up. YOU brought up Abu Graib in the first place and contended that it was an “example” of our use of “torture.” It wasn’t any such thing. You contend that McCain MERELY made a propaganda tape as a result of his claimed torture. His fellow POWs say that he gave the NVA actionable intelligence information that resulted in American casualties. I tend to believe what THEY say about it (who were THERE, after all) instead of left-wing apologists for McCain’s perfidy.


#28

Only in your distorted way of thinking. The fact remains McCain, after being tortured, made a recording which the Viet Cong used for propaganda purposes.

The bottom line is, without mixing apples and oranges, Lt. Gen. Thomas McInerney stated a fact when he said on FoxNews “It [torture] worked on John [McCain]. That’s why they call him ‘Songbird John’” And the song was dubbed McCain’s Tokyo Rose recording. Google it!

So, why did FoxNews decide to ban him for stating a fact? Seems FoxNews has caved into our politically correct crowd, and that should make you very, very happy.

JWK


#29

They were sodomizing people, forcing them to perform oral sex on one another, chain to a bed with urine-stained underwear on their face, physically beaten, and in the vase of Manadel al-Jamadi, to death.

Yes that is torture Dave, so you cannot play semantics with me.

You need only answer me one thing; is forcing prisoners into humiliation through torture, a “success”?

If not, mentioning McCain’s propaganda video is moot. It’s not relevant to the question of whether torture works.


#30

Which is not intel.

Advanced interrogation is predicated on intel, so unless you’re going to give me proof McCain did that, you’re just feeding me a bad argument, and you’re ceding the advantage to critics of torture.

Make a better argument; why is that so hard? Dave seems to think it’s easy thing to prove that McCain was providing intel, so why have you not done that?


#31

It’s not “easy to prove” because McCain has had such political power for so long that the proof that someone like AS might believe has long ago been destroyed or classified beyond anyone’s ability to access it…and with both the cooperation by and connivance of the “Deep Staters” such as that lying SOB formerly in charge of the CIA.

What AS refuses to acknowledge is that this 5th column has been populating the federal bureaucracies for several decades now. It’s not just the top echelons of the FBI and DOJ. It’s also the top AND lower levels of the CIA, DEA, EPA, Department of State, Departments of Defense, Energy, Education, Labor, HUD and even the White House’s permanent staff.


#32

And? What does that have to do with McCain submitting to torture and making a recording for the Viet Cong used for propaganda purposes?

Torture works. So why has FoxNews banned McInerney for stating a fact?

Lt. Gen. Thomas McInerney stated a fact when he said on FoxNews “It [torture] worked on John [McCain]. That’s why they call him ‘Songbird John’” And the song sung by McCain was dubbed McCain’s Tokyo Rose recording. Google it!

So, why did FoxNews decide to ban him for stating a fact? Seems FoxNews has caved into our politically correct crowd, and that should make you very, very happy.

JWK


#33

In fact, even the GOP is infested with stealth communists/progressives and socialists who are part of this Fifth Column movement which operates at the top of the Democrat Party Leadership. Their mission is to bring socialism to America as the rule of law.

This movement dates back as far as 1889 and Walter E. Kidd, publisher of the Dakota Ruralist, a newspaper with a motto that stated: “Socialism in Our Time”.

JWK

The unavoidable truth is, our Fifth Column social democrat political leaders’ plan for “free” college tuition will be paid for by confiscating the paychecks of millions of college graduates who worked for and paid their own way through college and are now trying to finance their own economic needs.


#34

You just admitted I’m right; unless Abu Graib, propaganda, is the sort of “success” you look for in torture, propaganda isn’t the measure of success here. Useful intelligence is.

Either be more discerning John, or you admit you’re not even treating your own argument seriously.
You’re feeding crap, and pretending it’s good enough, then get all “offended” when people point it out.


#35

You literally purported that it was easy, that a google search would find that information.

This Dave, where is your source for this claim?

And further, why isn’t that the evidence, and why are we bothering to talk about a propaganda video, when propaganda, is not the standard for saying torture works?

Since, y’know, when we do propaganda with our own prisoners, it’s welcomed with shock and derision, not purported as evidence that torture works?


#36

…and yet, we would not have gotten to OBL’s driver/courier without waterboarding and would therefore not have gotten to OBL himself without it. It WORKED and provided us with actionable intel–which we acted on with successes your sort attribute to the brilliance of Obama.


#37

And you deflect.

Dave, I’m not here, to talk about whether torture works, I’m saying why the HELL is POW PROPAGANDA being used to justify it?

If you avoid the question, then you basically admit it’s a bad argument, and that the real justification, is intelligence, making the McCain video, moot and irrelevant.


#38

:roll_eyes:

There you go again, making stuff up.

The fact is, the General said on FoxNews “It [torture] worked on John [McCain]. That’s why they call him ‘Songbird John’” And the song has been dubbed by vets, “McCain’s Tokyo Rose recording”. Google it! IT’S A FACT

So, why did FoxNews decide to ban McInerney for stating a fact? I believe the reason is FoxNews has caved into our politically correct crowd.

JWK


#39

For a BS reason, Propaganda.

Unless you’re saying propaganda is the standard for determining whether torture works, your argument isn’t sincere.

Either tell me making that making propaganda of our own prisoners is somehow a success for intense interrogation, or drop the issue. You admit the argument is faulty.

And if you have evidence that McCain did provide useful intel to the Vietnamese, post that instead of this drivel.

You’ve shown that you have no trouble providing other sources, that hold back on this, makes no sense.


#40

But it worked, as stated by the General.

The fact is, the General said on FoxNews “It [torture] worked on John [McCain]. That’s why they call him ‘Songbird John’” And the song has been dubbed by vets, “McCain’s Tokyo Rose recording”. Google it! IT’S A FACT

So, why did FoxNews decide to ban McInerney for stating a fact? I believe the reason is FoxNews has caved into our politically correct crowd.

JWK