How has Trump done with jobs?

You being a dumb****.

Admit to your error, your full error. Quit minimizing.

Your “test” video proves ONLY that coasting downhill without regard to traffic allows the regenerative braking to engage and add charge to the batteries somewhat. Nobody DRIVES like that, however. Not if they are responsible adults. You drive your car to keep up with other traffic–and avoid slower traffic, by the way. Nobody coasts downhill, disregarding other traffic and traffic speed. Likewise, nobody “charges” their batteries by having the car dragged around in a circle for 15 minutes by a pickup truck. Not if they are responsible, adult drivers anyway.

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Well, let’s see…

I predict one of the following:

1 deny
2 deflect
3 Ignore

I’m going to say number 2 and a little number 3 since you never decided to explain…

So PD…

Oh boy…

First, the range gauges on gasoline-powered cars aren’t very accurate, they are estimates (we’ll address this).

Second, since you didn’t record anything, we have to take your word for all of this….

But let’s discuss possible answers.

Your Honda’s (?) fuel estimator is running an average estimate over some moving window. This varies by manufacturer. I know that Audi, and Volvo use the last 20-mile fuel mile average and measures that against what it estimates as the remaining fuel. I’d guess that most manufacturers use something similar, though the distance window may vary.

Remaining fuel.

One of the problems with ICE cars is how the initial fuel is measured, that being that ICE cars all use floats in the tank, which isn’t very precise as a result the numbers are simply estimates and can vary based a few factors.

Thus to answer the question of how your Honda appeared to gain mileage, we’d need to know more about:

  1. How Honda estimates the figure it displays (probably an average of the last 20 miles or so)?
  2. How the mechanical system of measurement works (older cars use different and more inaccurate methods, vacuum tubes for instance)?
  3. How you were driving in the period prior to the trip that you illustrated for us.
  4. How much fuel was really in your tank when your car took it’s initial estimate (for instance, if you park on an incline when the car estimates fuel, the float in the tank may indicate more (or less) fuel)?
  5. Lastly, if I remember correctly you said your Accord was 2012, maybe older (2008)? I would question the fuel calibration on a car that old and the fact that it increased in mileage seems to lend some evidence to this idea.

If your indicator increased in range, that would simply mean that the period before your last trip you were using more fuel and as you drove you began using less and the computer simply recalculated based on your most recent trip or the measurement of your initial conditions were calculated incorrectly (again, do to the fact that it relies on float in your tank).

The Tesla (and incidentally most hybrids) give real real-time indications, which is why when the gauge says “zero” on Tesla, the car is literally out of power, unlike ICE cars which have 25-125 miles left (depending on the car). You can, on ICE vehicles, get real-time estimates by plugging into the OBDII port with aftermarket computers like ScanGauge

Bottom line, unlike the Tesla (and other EV’s) that can put energy back into the battery via regeneration and increase range, your car did not add any energy back into the car, your initial conditions changed or your driving changed and the car simply recalculated (or miscalculated based on incorrect calibration) your remaining miles based on the new information.

Dave, you fell behind again:

That driver is clearly following road rules.

And the bigger issue: you denied this was possible at all. You’re just as wrong as RET was.

You were wrong, and spoke from ignorance.

Quit. doing that. Especially after doing it for 10 pages, dear God.


It’s not possible (so we get the video where the Tesla is towed)


It’s not possible under real world conditions (show them a video of a Tesla regening while it’s going down hill)


Its not possible because the video showed a drive going too slow.

So here is a Tesla in real-world conditions maintaining a constant speed down a shallow but reasonably long hill (I have several like this near me) and it gains range.

Now, how do delude yourself into not believing the obvious, right here in front of you?

Ever hear the concept of conservation of energy? WHEN are you EV fan-boys EVER going to admit that you can’t get something for nothing? Certainly not in any appreciable quantity that would tend to prevent your vehicles from running out of charge before you could make it from one side of Oklahoma to the other without spending at least a full night re-charging your batteries.
BTW, my Honda is a 2013, but fully loaded with every option available that year except a 6-cylinder engine. It’s 7 years old with a bit under 70,000 miles. It’s serviced regularly and has the oil and filters replaced exactly when needed. I use ethanol-free gas when I can get it, which here in OK that’s fairly easily done, filling up with mid-level octane fuel instead of the low-octane stuff. Where I live and re-fuel there are no “inclines”.

The final comment from me is this: Go ahead and spend that $100K +/- on a Tesla if it makes you happy. I’ll still be driving my Honda quite happily long after you’ve spent another $100K in repairs and accessories to keep your EV working…or having it replaced altogether.

Where do you get this stuff?

You’ve now reached new heights in parading your ignorance on this topic.

Again, more goal post shifting.

First, it was

  1. Teslas don’t regenerate any energy


  1. They can regenerate, but only when used in ways inconsistent with the operation of a car.


  1. They can regenerate, but only when driven in ways that are rude to other drivers

And now…

  1. they can regenerate, but not enough to get you from one side of OK to another without a charge…

When are you just going to admit you were just wrong?

Regenerative braking add energy to the system.

We’ve never even discussed how much. You are the only one that’s claimed it’s inconsequential.

Thanks, for that info. The explanation, to why you appeared to get better mileage is simple, either:

  1. The car incorrectly calculated the amount of fuel it began with (remember, they all use floats which are not that accurate)

Or, and more likely

  1. Your driving conditions changed enough for the car to recalculate mileage. The calculation is:

Last 20 miles average x Amount of fuel remaining= Miles before empty

It would, but I’m more practical than that. My car is a 2016 and has several years left before it will need to be replaced, that said I’ve given serious thought to a model 3 as my next car, but there are several new EV’s coming online in the next several years and I’d like to give the industry a few more years to see what exciting and practical innovations arise. One company is going to run its system at 900volts, which will increases efficiency even greater than what Tesla has managed (caliming ranges of over 400 miles with similar sized battery packs, perhaps even smaller). If they can innovate, and do the other things necessary to bring a vehicle like that to market, we’ll see the practicality of EV increase even more.

That said, you don’t need $100k to buy a Tesla. First, the Model 3 starts at $38k and when compared to a Honda Civic, has a similar cost of ownership over the first 5 years, but significantly less after that. Of course, you get different benefits and drawbacks in each, so choose carefully.

That said, the is enormous potential for innovation in EV’s and while there is room to innovate in ICE, it comes at a much slower pace given the age of the tech.

As a side note, I think it’s kind of ironic, because when the government came out with CARB mandates and increasing mileage in cars, people like you were claiming it was unreasonable and yet here we are, with a handful of 5 passenger SUV’s capable of 27 city and over 30 on the highway.

Everything about an EV cost less over the long term, save the batteries.

Here’s just a few parts in ICE’s that don’t exist in EV’s

Every single one of which I’ve had to replace on a car I’ve owned in the past.

Add transmissions, clutches, torque converters, timing belt/s chains, carburetor systems and you have much higher repair costs after the first 5 years. Not to mention oil, transmission, water, steering fluids that need to be replaced on a schedule.

Throw in Moore’s law and, in 5-10 years, ICE’s will be limited to the same nitch that EV’s exist in right now.

Your arguments are based entirely on ideological grounds, ignoring the obvious and that’s what makes you so dangerous.

:joy::joy::joy: If the government is stupid enough to allow it, they’d be foolish not to take advantage. Who was it that (reputedly) said “I have a moral obligation to separate a sucker from his money”?

The government doesn’t HAVE any money that it hasn’t first stolen from taxpayers. Only a moron thinks the government gives out “free stuff.”
BTW. I didn’t make all those claims you say I did. RET did. If you can’t even make correct attributions, why should anyone believe a word you say about anything else?

Agreed, but Tesla would still be foolish not to take the money. I wish the government would offer me some money, because I would most certainly take it, and be glad to get it.

Another real-world scenario where someone drove 57 miles with regen and without. Noted that he had 18% more energy left using regen braking.

Ever here you are wrong? Ever hear do your homework?

You insisted on absolute bull crap for nearly 100 posts.

You knew NOTHING, and insisted BS. You have no excuse for this.

I begged you to look this up, and you refused. You kept throwing on more BS.

That’s just crummy behavior Dave.

When I ask you to look things up, how about you actually do it?

Actually, I DID look stuff up about the Tesla and was accuse of lying by CSB because I didn’t copy and paste what I found. Is there anything else you want to accuse me of? Do it now because I wouldn’t care if you and CSB were both electrocuted by your Tesla batteries.

  • Denied the price
  • Denied the range
  • Denied a feature, listed in the owners manual, and posted several times with videos of owners using it.

You doubled down on BULLCRAP, even with the truth staring you RIGHT IN THE FACE.

I call that a lack of humility and laziness.

“Copy & paste”? I’ve followed tech news on Tesla for 4 years. I know what the price and the range of the Model 3 is, because I cared to follow it.

You didn’t. You do not care Dave. You haze ZERO authentic interest in this topic. You do not follow it.

Pretending you knew anything, was BS. You’re just a johnny-come-lately putting on airs. You showed that by insisting on bullcrap you made up.

I made up nothing, you moron. Like I said, go buy one. If you think you can get one for $38K instead of the posted price I quoted above, have at it. I found it on my first try with Google to find something about the Tesla S75 since you were BOTH claiming that the S-models were cheap and efficient.

“Braking doesn’t ADD charge to a Tesla battery. It merely reduces the amount of charge that’s being DRAINED from the battery.”

You made this up. Because you couldn’t be bothered to look it up.

Either look up what you don’t know, or don’t bother talking to me about it.

I don’t want your made up stories.

Google Model 3. Which costs $39,500, and in the LR version has +300 mile range.

DO IT Dave. No arguments, do it.

You have no excuse.

For the love of god. First, I didn’t accuse you of lying, I accused you of being computer illiterate.

If you are so lazy that you can’t scroll back a few posts and look up what I actually said, why should we believe that you took the time to Google anything?

You guys are BOTH fools. I’m done with you both.

That is absolutely true of the regen braking system if no gimmicks are used, if gimmicks are used the car is unusable; you will lose your license from excessive tickets if you try drag your Tesla around behind pickup trucks or drive 16 mph on public highways :rofl:

Looking at what you think those repairs cost I can see why you think Teslas are cheaper! You would have to know absolutely nothing about cars and use only the dealer for repairs to pay those prices for those simple bolt on components :rofl:

Also, those components last a minimum of 150 thousand miles on every car I have owned so those are second or third owner expenses, not original buyer expenses.

Teslas are not cheaper, not more efficient, not better for the environment and not more convenient than internal combustion engine vehicles over the lifespan of the vehicle when all expenses are considered.