Wow…this was a shock.
I’m quite surprised ol’ J.F.K was a facist. I figured it’d be Warren Harding.
At the end of the article: What a twist!
Hm, interesting. I’m not too shocked to be honest, JFK’s “pro civil rights” ruse was always phony and fake imo, and there’s evidence to support that. Glad I stopped liking him years ago
I only still like Bobby Kennedy, he was Pro-Israel from what I gathered.
I like Bobby a little better than Jack, but I never cared for any of the Kennedy clan. Their whole lives were such a sham it’s not funny. Big daddy Joe made his millions by bootlegging and partnership with the mafia for years. Not exactly an example of a law-abiding citizen accomplishing the American dream. And, what made me like them even less was the fact that all of them seemed to have great difficulty staying faithful to their marriage vows. The straw for me was Teddy’s little adventure in Chappaquiddick for which he NEVER was held accountable. I also believe that the Kennedy boys had something to do with Marilyn Monroe’s death. Not sure what that was, but their hands certainly were not clean. An embarrassment to the Catholic Church to be sure, but even more so and embarrassment to the integrity of the presidency. I believe that both John and Robert’s assassination were mob-connected, particularly the mob boss in New Orleans–Marcello.
To be fair, Kennedy was Catholic, and the Catholic church at the start of World War II, around 1937 when Kennedy made his remarks, the Catholic Church supported Hitler. That support later diminished during the War, and the awe the article attempts to portray as admiration doesn’t really come off that way. Hitler was a legend. A terrible legend, but still a person who changed humanity and the world for the worse, and I don’t think Kennedy’s later remarks show any hint of support for Hitler.
“I have come to the conclusion that fascism is the right thing for Germany and Italy. … What are the evils of fascism compared with communism? … The Germans are really too good - that’s why people conspire against them - they do it to protect themselves. … The docility of German officials shows how easy it would be to seize power … in Germany you have neither the curiosity of Americans, nor their innate oppositional ‘I’m from Missouri, you’ll have to show me!’ attitude toward authority.”
I think this is a better representation of his views. Support for a new Germany after its decline during World War I, in opposition to Communism. To stretch that to say Kennedy supported the killing of Jews or the genocide and evils performed by Hitler is dishonest.
Trekky: This is the same argument that has been rehashed and rehased on other threads. If you want to believe that Hitler’s hatred of the Jews and anyone else who wasn’t/isn’t of pure aryan race, was rooted in the Catholic Church, well, so be it. Believe whatever you want. If you really STUDIED Hitler and his rise to power and his ultimate annihilation of over 20 million people, and the history of Germany as a whole prior to and after WWI, you’d realize how ridiculous that argument really is. I am going to say this for the last time: There were INDIVIDUALS within the Catholic Church–some of whom were high up the ladder of the Church–who DID sympathize and support the nazis. That was NEVER advocated by the Pope or the magisterium EVER. The pope at the time remained silent on the topic–and many people read into his silence that he supported the nazis. That is their opinion. The Holy Father had legitimate reasons for remaining silent and, on the outside, neutral. Hitler was about as Catholic as Jim Jones or Jack Chick was. And, just for your information, there were MANY European and American collaborators to the Nazis–even a Jew who rose through the ranks of the S.S.–much to their own demise. Why don’t you do a little studying before you fire off your opinons??? The fact that you hold fast to these oft-proclaimed lies says that you have been properly and, most likely irrevocably brainwashed.
I’m not sure Trekky meant that the Catholic Church loved Hitler at *any *time, but they did see him as a preferable bulwark against communism (which isn’t exactly kind toward religion)…in fact until Kristallnacht there were many, many, people who held that same belief. Hitler loved to show off his anti-communism to the world in order to garner support and hindsight is 20/20.
I’m not sure what your point is, CT. I never said that the Catholic Church condoned the killing of Jews or anything like that, but the Catholic Church as an organization has deep roots in Germany, and they did support the rise of a new Germany before the second World War with Hitler at the helm, signing a treaty in 1933 to not comment on German politics in exchange for non-interference in the church from Germany. Once the War started, they of course dropped their support, but that would explain Kennedy’s support as a member of the Catholic Church in 1937. My reference to Catholic support for Hitler is purely in regards to preventing a Communistic Germany and not the holocaust.
Robert: I didn’t interpret Trekky as saying that the CC loved Hitler. What he is saying, and has said numerous times on other threads, is that Hitler’s anti-semitism was a direct result of the Catholic Church’s support of anti-semitism. This false idea has been around for ages and has been disputed successfully many times. The accusation is groundless. My point was/is that (and there is a very long discussion about this very topic somewhere on RO) Hitler’s devotion/adherence to the Catholic Church’s teachings (or even acknowledgement of such) were due to his parents’ (especially his father) insistence that he behave as such. Like many kids/adolescents in the past and present, they pay lip service to the Church because their parents demand this from them. Many abandon their belief in the Catholic faith immediately upon being free from their parents’ yoke. Hitler was much too much of a rabid megalomaniac and would never submit to any authority or belief system outside of his own. I get very tired of reading/hearing the same arguments which have been more than adequately proven wrong numerous times. This argument generally comes from folks who have an ax to grind regarding the Catholic Church.
Again, let me repeat myself: There were some Catholic bishops in Germany who supported Hitler. But that was not the official position of the Catholic Church. Yes, the Catholic Church sees communism as a great evil, but would never choose one evil over another evil. And, after Martin Luther broke from the Catholic Church, Germany became a predominately Lutheran country.
The point of the article isn’t that a young JFK (as Trekky points out, the son of a wealthy Catholic Nazi sympathizer) held such views. It is that there is double standard concerning the reporting of such “interesting” trivia. And I think Bozell’s right.
Totally agree. Thanks for bringing that point up. But, I guess my point was that this didn’t surprise me about JFK. I sort of had the feeling that as I was reading the article that whoever the person was, it would be shocking. I didn’t find it shocking, but very sad to add another ugly dimension to John F. Kennedy’s profile.
JFK also isn’t alive anymore, so I don’t think it’s a good example. Better examples are Gary Hart, birthers, or the stories about Obama’s campaign contributions from the American Communist Party. The double standard isn’t nearly as prevalent if you use living people.
Lest we forget, Donald Rumsfeld shook hands with Saddam Hussein, and Bush43 heaped praise on Col. Gadhafi when Libya “came back into the fold” in 2003 or 2004.
John Kennedy may have been interested in Hitler and his methods in the 1930s, but the future president still fought against Axis powers in WWII. I’d say JFK got it right in the end.
As for the Kennedy Brothers, they were great Americans who, like all of us, are flawed in some way. You may not have liked or agreed with Jack and Bobby, but they both paid the ultimate price in service to our country even if they weren’t wearing uniforms at the time.
May they rest in eternal peace, and may the better world they envisioned for all us some day come to pass.
Oh yeah…and I’m sure all those resistance fighters in the Bay of Pigs that were left to the slaughter feel the same way… When one holds down a position of authority and respect, especially the highest one in the land, one would hope that the position and authority is not defiled. Your statement about other presidents and other politicians’ mistakes does not diminish one tiny bit the devastating effects the Kennedys had on this country. All of them have caused great public scandal and have brought disgrace to their name and to the office of the President. The attempt to lessen one’s responsibility is so common is no surprise. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve heard children and adults say to me, “But Johnny started it! But Nancy did thus and so!” in order to lessen the severity of their own actions. It is a common human defect found in many these days. Sad.
The Kennedy Brothers were great Americans, and we were lucky to have them. Sadly, they were taken from us too soon by the acts of madmen, but, as Teddy said so eloquently in his 1980 concession speech to the Democratic national convention, “the work goes on, the cause endures, the hope still lives, and the dream shall never die.”
Since you brought up the Bay of Pigs, let’s just say that JFK’s decision was not nearly as catastrophic in the long term as Ronald Reagan’s decision in Beirut that led to the death of 241 Marines. If you don’t believe me, ask Hezbollah. That Hezbollah is still around to ask is a direct result of Reagan’s cut-and-run actions after Beirut. Does that make Reagan an awful man? No, not anymore than the youthful musings of JFK make him a bad man. Reagan did what he thought was best for the country at the time, just as JFK did, and while a case could be made that they both made the wrong decisions, a case could be made that things might have turned out even worse had they decided differently.
Bottom line, John F. Kennedy was a great man and a great president, and while I do not condone the way he cheated on Jackie, I’d still take him over any president we’ve had since then – Ronald Reagan and Bill Clinton included.
"In the long history of the world, only a few generations have been granted the role of defending freedom in its hour of maximum danger. I do not shrink from this responsibility – I welcome it. I do not believe that any of us would exchange places with any other people or any other generation. The energy, the faith, the devotion which we bring to this endeavor will light our country and all who serve it – and the glow from that fire can truly light the world.
And so, my fellow Americans: ask not what your country can do for you – ask what you can do for your country.
My fellow citizens of the world: ask not what America will do for you, but what together we can do for the freedom of man.
Finally, whether you are citizens of America or citizens of the world, ask of us here the same high standards of strength and sacrifice which we ask of you. With a good conscience our only sure reward, with history the final judge of our deeds, let us go forth to lead the land we love, asking His blessing and His help, but knowing that here on earth God’s work must truly be our own. "
-President John F. Kennedy, Jan. 20, 1961
I think Kennedy far from defiled the position of president during the Cuban Missile Crisis, the closest we’ve ever come to nuclear war. He was a good president.
JFK didnt just cheat on Jackie, he literally couldnt go 48 hours without cheating on his wife. He was a horrible president because he couldnt function without sex and that led to a slew of questionable decisions. He is one of the worst presidents of the 20th century in both character and leadership.