Republicans Are Weak


I know and GREAT, because you clearly must agree, that in fact its a true statement and that its not 100% attributed to anyone, but in fact everyone has said it because this is what we say: The obvious is obvious. And, its moot who said it first or what exact words they may have used, PD is just as correct as anyone else in his assertion, no more, no less.

Don’t know if its reasonable but its logical and that is why it makes sense, which should be obvious…




Confused, don’t worry, its ok, normal for liberals because they think in terms of exact wording, spelling, what date and TIME it was said, was it raining that day, but NEVER what was the point being made or its results.


The democrats passed Obamacare without a single republican vote. Some of them didn’t want to but Nancy and Harry got their ducks all in a line. None of them really knew what they were voting for. They resorted to lies about abortion funding to get Bart Stupak and some other pro-life democrats to vote for it. In the end, they got it done and had their victory dance.

I don’t know if the any of the repeal/replace plans are any good. IT DOESN’T REALLY MATTER. The repeal/replace and the budget affects the CBO scoring for the tax cuts and opens the door for the legislative process to get it passed. A big chunk of the post-November market rally is in anticipation of a large stimulating tax cut. If they fail to pass the Trump agenda it can go down faster than it went up it went up and the 2018 election will go down the drain with the economy.

The republicans pay far too much attention to screaming animals at their town halls (who will never, ever vote for them) and the mainstream media’s propaganda. The electorate, on the other hand will pay attention to their take-home pay, their IRS refund check, their health care premium, their IRA portfolio, their employment status, their neighbour’s employment status, and whether their twenty-something offspring is living in their basement (or not). By comparison, the MSM and the screaming progressive thugs are tuned out as just political noise.

I don’t know if they are weak, stupid or under poor leadership; as of today, they are headed back down the road to their comfortable status as the loyal, ineffective, rubber stamp “opposition”. They are proving that they are good at throwing red meat but not so good at actual governing. If they screw this up I will consider voting in future elections as a wasted hour out of my life that I can never get back.

They should heed James (the snake) Carville’s words of wisdom:



No… he said it was in a book, at a specific chapter. A chapter that doesn’t talk about public spending, and never states anything like that quote.

Dave was wrong, simple as that.


I can think of any number of possibilities, including that he looked at the wrong book (or you did). Bottom line: I DON’T CARE. You can say he’s posting egregious nonsense till the cows come home; that’s within the forum rules. Saying he’s lying is not. So don’t. This is, as Pete would call it, Mod-hat territory. I’m not going to keep arguing around this hamster wheel.


First of all I have not read the book (waiting on the movie) but I did stay in a Holiday Inn.

Therein lies the difference between you and me between the far left and a conservative. The left is focused on the exact words and the exact book, whereas my focus is on what it says and I don’t need to change happy to glad, nor do I care. In the short run the left will beat the tub and use this as justification to call PD or Trump liars because they used happy instead of glad, said it was on page 38 when it was on page 39. The people that run in your circles will listen and believe and in return not vote for that guy because he is a liar or what ever moniker the left can hang around his neck. But in the long the left will lose, because you ignore the reality, the point, the lesson to be learned and the left will be doomed to repeat history’s failures.

No one in the world has tried harder to make communism-socialism work than the USSR. From about 1922 -1991 they pulled out all stops and did what ever it took to make it a success. One of the tools they used to make it a success the left has begun to use and it will only grow in intensity. Russia murdered its own people over the course of 1917-1987 about 65 MILLION people in Democide. The only thing stopping Democide in the US will be my gun.

If you really want to study something and understand what todays left advocates and what it will result in I strongly suggest the rise and fall of the USSR-communism-socialism!


I looked at the book. AS looked at a reprint of the book on-line (suitably edited, no doubt.)


I also looked at scans of physical prints of the book from 1838, 1862, 1899 and 2004.

The picture I posted comes from the 1899 print directly. Anyone can look any one of these prints, and see for themselves that your quote isn’t there.

You are wrong Dave, and you should have been honest enough to admit it. I shouldn’t even have to say it.


No, conservatives are interested in absolute truths. The very existence of Natural law speaks to this.

Leftists use Post-modernism to try and twist words, or “massage” their meaning to make everything about perspective. Which is exactly what you’ve done here.


You better reread what you wrote…this EXACTLY what you are doing. Sure I believe in absolute truths and that is reflected in my statement the phrase is TRUE, its not the exact wording or the spelling, is what is says true or untrue? Your entire focus in the thread is based solely upon wording and NOT the truth. Typical leftist thinking, the truth does not matter the process to get there is the only thing that counts.

This is why the left hangs on to Socialism like a baby with a bottle and why they cannot accept its total failure. They believe its the process of socialism that is important and if only they can get the right tweaks then it will be a success. Left thinking is process focused, its what they do.

You would hate working for me: I am results focused, don’t care when you come to work, when you go home how long for lunch and what you wear. These are the results, I want x amount of executable code every week, you don’t do that you may want to work where they care more about what your wore today that what you produce…


***Waayy *** to late for you to even go there.

Reread what I said about a page ago concerning what Democracy in America actually identified as the greatest threat to America.

You are trying to insist that Dave’s phrase is in the book. But it is not. **FACT. **

Why isn’t it in there? Because the exploitation of the public purse was something Alexis de Tocqueville assigned to bad actor politicians. Not the public a large. To him, the real threat was soft despotism:

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Control. Bureaucracy. Isolation. These are the things he concluded could destroy America, because of the American public’s unwillingness to organize centrally, and their pursuit of material wealth and pleasures eclipsing their education and self-betterment.

It is a subtle point, much more rich in its analysis, and far more accurate to the problems we suffer from now.

Talk up Dave’s phrase all you want, but I, I don’t want trite words, I don’t want generalizations, I don’t want errors. I’ll take what he actually said, because it’s both more relevant, and more useful.

> Typical leftist thinking, the truth does not matter the process to get there is the only thing that counts.

Capitalism is a continuous process of Trial & error, so are the social laboratories embodied by the states. This is one of their strengths.

Socialism OTOH denies almost any process, insisting we automatically know what needs to be affirmed, what posits of human nature can conditioned or “educated” out of people, who can simply be killed, to forge a new society of Stakhanovites.

Experimentation and creativity die. The Soviets had some brilliant engineers and mathematicians, but they were always hobbled by the system that ruled them; one that never allowed for anyone to take lead on anything.


LOL you cannot let go of the words and what order they may be in, the statement is a FACT and its true, come to grips with that and you can move on in life otherwise you are just stuck in the sand spinning your wheel.

This is a TRUE and FACTUAL Statement: “America will remain a great nation ONLY until the people figure out that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury!”

When the people American people figure out that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury America will not longer be a great nation.

Both say the same thing , both are true both are facts, no matter who said them, wrote them or anything else. Until you begin to care about the results and stop focusing on the process you will be forever mired in your swamp of failure…

The rest of your comments (on capitalism/socialism) are nothing but idle thoughts that bear no resemblance to reality. Its clear you cannot distinguish between process and results…


17Oaks has made the most stunningly obtuse series of posts I’ve seen in my near-decade of posting on this board.


Do you ever read your own???


Moot, Democracy In America never says anything like this. Not in a different order, not with different words.

I know that, because I read the book (unlike you), and understand his thinking in it.

So this reasoning falls flat, you’re simply obfuscating at this point.

> This is a TRUE and FACTUAL Statement:

Doesn’t matter if you think it is. The point was that Tocqueville never said it, nor anything like it.

Making this claim means you *** moved the goal posts of the debate***, which is a post-modern tactic.

Instead addressing the actual point, you moved to, “Well what’s our perspective on the quote?”

You use leftist tactics, while claiming “I’m one”? Be a little more self-aware please. This is exactly how they argue the definition of racism.


You HAVEN’T “read the book”. What you’ve read is the internet’s VERSION of the book. I have the actual book, printed in a single volume. Get yourself a copy and read THAT instead of some leftie’s REPRINT of it.


Just to be clear, you’re arguing that the quote is in your hard copy book, and the reason that it’s not in electronic versions is because of a leftist conspiracy. Presumably, the websites that also point out that the quote is misattributed are also part of this same leftist conspiracy.

You’re spectacularly full of shit about this. It’s shameful and pathetic. The chapter in which you claim to have found the quote is about American political epistemology, and has nothing whatsoever to do with public spending. Nothing remotely like that quote appears in the chapter. Stop lying.


Incorrect, you’ve continued to miss something critical.





Are scans of the pages of the book. Not a transcription of the text. Not an “internet version”. It’s pictures of an actual book, printed in 1841, 1840, and 1838.

The full contents of these books can be viewed at any time. They’re completely archived. Every single page is shown.

And once again, your quote is not in them Dave. So consider it debunked.


PD, remember you cannot win the battle against the far left thinkers. They will spin, dodge, weave and are like trying to nail jello to a wall, just rest in that they will lose the war, they always have, always will…