“Another one of our great national institutions, the Boy Scouts of America, has officially lost its way. An organization with an impressive history of over one century has buckled to the insidious forces of political correctness. The latest sign occurred this week as the Boy Scouts formally opened their doors to girls. In 2018, girls will be able to join the Cub Scout program and the following year will become eligible to attain the highest rank, Eagle Scout.”
Someone ought to make an organization that prepares young boys to make ethical and moral choices over their lifetimes by instilling in them the values of the Scout Oath and Law. Maybe the girls could have one too…
I don’t really see the problem; C.A.P., the organization I’m apart of, is co-ed, and has been basically since its founding.
And unlike the Boy Scouts, C.A.P. has functional responsibilities— they handle 90% of search & rescue work for the Air Force.
4-H is also co-ed.
My own mother, who has operated inside all three of these organizations, and the Girl Scouts, says " Who the hell wants to be a Girl scout today? They do nothing and just teach you environmental crap."
Ergo, I see this less about a collapse in Boy Scout culture, and more about how useless their counterpart organization has become. To the point that girls and their parents (who many times have sons, so they can see the contrast), want access to the clearly better option.
So after a group of people ruin one organization, the unhappy remnants of that failed group should be brought into a new host. Then they can culturally enrich the new host to more closely resemble the old failed one.
Reminds me of your immigration position.
Yes; as they tend to represent the cream of said failing organization. Note though, that the key term here is failing, not failed.
They know enough that their organization is failing, and want to go to a different place where they can make more out of their own potential.
Works out with the employees of companies all the time, I don’t see why volunteer organizations would be any different.
Reminds me that you don’t know how immigration works.
But then again, basically no ones does, because no one alive today, was around during the last great immigration wave.
The only people who have an idea, are the forensic examiners of history, the historians, and economists.
Meanwhile, there are plenty of people who examine our past history of immigration with rose-tinted glasses, but look at the current immigrants with disdain.
Not realizing that they’re applying a double standard, because with the former, they have the benefit of knowing the end result. With the latter, they blame immigrants for still being mid-swing in a trend that takes longer than a generation (or even two) to pan out.
The people who came here 100 years ago were low skilled peasants with no education and very little hope of managing clerical work. That was fine when 90+% of people were working with their hands. Their intelligence generally exceeded the demand any potential work could ask of them.
100 years later, we already have a glut of natives who have difficulty finding work. There isn’t a lot of demand for low skilled labor in an increasingly service based economy. And the vast majority of our unregulated, open border free trade immigrants are not capable of handling the future economy.
And that’s merely examining the economic angle while ignoring the pernicious cultural problems. You’ll see the same thing in the Boy Scouts when the current Girl Scout leadership leaves and infiltrates it. When you import people from a dysfunctional group, your existing group will become more like the dysfunctional group.
Immigrants are the workers turning up at these farmers and meat packers doorstep. Demanding that they stop hiring them, helps nobody. It actually makes our economy less effective, and results in less jobs for natives.
Have you ever asked yourself how it was the Romans were able to achieve dominance over so many different populations, for so long?
Even over people they hadn’t actually conquered; who willfully Romanized of their own accord?
Or how about why the Volga Germans dominated Russia for two centuries?
Or why even the whole of Eastern Europe had to be educated and practice norms, created by Germans, for most of the same period?
It was for the same reason the massive flood of immigrants, totalling more than 1/5 of our population in early 20th century, didn’t result in a balkanized America. Same to Canada and its own 1/5 immigrant population today.
If you are the culture that can consistently access the middle class, and the quality of life it promises, then it is that culture which will come dominate. Even if it’s in the minority.
Just as with warfare in the modern era; it’s not numbers that matter, it’s human capital. If the central culture is the one with the most, then it’s the one immigrants (or even Natives, in the case of the Russians and barbarian Romans) will gather into, and adopt norms to imitate.
Assimilation works through convergence, where foreign populations drop whatever aspects keep them from entering the middle class, while keeping the rest.
The native population then adopts traits from the foreigners that it somehow finds novel or enjoyable; like Italian food, or putting gifts under a tree… or drinking on St. Patricks Day.
There has never been a case where a culture at a lower state of development, overwrote a culture of a higher state, simply through immigration. It’s never happened.
There are plenty of cases in the world of Free-trade nations with more foreign workers than Natives. All we’re doing right now is maybe returning back to the historical average we had in the 19th century.
It’s a problem that businesses using illegal immigration caused in the first place. There is no reason for me to try to go out there as an unskilled laborer, because there is no reason for a company to hire me at minimum wage+ and have to follow labor laws, when they can hire someone else for $4 an hour and use them as pseudo slave labor with a constant deportation threat hanging over their head.
First, the majority of our illegal immigrants are not assimilating. Second, there is nothing low IQ peasants can do in order to reach the middle class of 2017 America.
Back in Rome all you needed to do was be a carpenter or similar physical tasks. The number of skilled labor jobs is shrinking in the US and will be far less common in another two decades.
Someone with an IQ of 80 is simply not going to become a nurse or a network analyst. Agriculture would already be largely automated were it not for illegal use of pseudo slave labor.
And their wages are being subsidized by taxes. The illegal labor pool pays about $3,000 in taxes per household, but uses over $20,000 in tax money. Because their children receive education and medical care that the natives pay for. Their children grow up and never pay a net positive dollar in taxes.
You keep trying to conflate China, India, and Germany to Mexico and there is no comparison.
No… that’s backwards. Businesses had already been using this labor for decades, before the law stepped in, and made its usage illegal.
It was overreach, and it caused the situation to deteriorate rapidly. Law should never go to war with the economy or the livelihoods of people who were doing nothing wrong.
The reality, is that most employers hire their employees at standard rates, and just don’t bother to ensure their paperwork fully represents who they say they are.
The biggest employers of illegals are large corporate enterprises; not family owned businesses, although the latter would be harmed far more by not having access to cheaper labor like this.
The deportation threat is an externality of all this being forced to operate as a black market. It would be fixed quite easily, by us just once again allowing people in through a migrant worker program.
Eisenhower did it (the only president to make illegal immigration fall, by 95%), so it can hardly be said we can’t do this.
The immigrants themselves, perhaps, perhaps not ( and would again, make them no different than previous waves.)
Their children however do, and they learn English at about the same rate as Italians before them. They’re also declining in their tendency to speak Spanish at home.
Again, no different than previous waves, and again, not a barrier for their children.
If it’s even a problem, it fixes itself. Until then, there’s no cause to block employers from hiring them, when they clearly still have roles for these people to fill.
If they’re being hired, then they’re still useful, that’s self-evident. The jumping of the gun here to get rid of them is like Liberals taking pot shots at oil.
You’re leaving out what they contribute economically, and you don’t parse Federal vs States. Because with the former, they’re a net plus, thanks to their usage of ITINs.
The kids mostly stay here, and are mostly Americans themselves, so… I don’t see the problem. They’re no less an “investment” for us than the kids of Natives.
We have healthy demographics (one of basically two developed nations who do) because of immigrants like them. If you want to understand why positive growth in demographics is so critical, I suggest you check out Peter Zeihan.
Finally, entrepreneurs, disproportionately come out of populations of immigrants and their children. This is true for every nation on Earth.
They’re more likely to start businesses, and they’re more likely to hit on new ideas that can be brought to market. They also serve as international contacts for Americans to find markets to export their goods to.
This last point is even distinguishable between states, depending how many of a certain immigrant they have. More Filipinos, the more exports they make to the Philippines. More immigrants from El Salvador, the more exports that state makes to El Salvador.
In short? I’m not cynical about immigration (or population growth in general), because economics gives me no reason to be.
Your point on culture may in some ways be valid, but it ultimately folds into a larger point of how assimilation itself works. It takes the application of past experience to the current day, to know what is “strange” or not in that process.
Your’re examining in a vacuum. I’m examining in the light of Germans who had around 700 newspapers printed here in 1900, despite their immigration wave having peaked in 1870.
Among other “seemingly” non-assimilated things they did.
Again, you keep trying to conflate Italy and China with Mexico. Country of origin matters. And Mexico is a trash country. The people they’re sending up here are trash. They don’t assimilate, and their kids don’t amount to much. Nor do their grand children. Nor will their great, great, great grand children.
Look at the children of Chinese or European immigrants. Now look at the children of Mexican immigrants. Second generation Mexican immigrants on average will drain the federal government of over $200,000 per head over the course of their lives.
And note the problem gets WORSE with them in the 3rd generation. So they start out bad, improve a bit and then the grandchildren of the Mexican immigrants proceed to do worse than their parents.
Compare that to a 2nd generation children of Asian immigrants, who will pay a net positive of over $150,000 in taxes.
So no, I do not want to bring in more unskilled low intelligence scabs to prop up the profit margins of big business at the expense of native citizen taxpayers. We need a merit based immigration plan, as Trump has proposed. We need to kick our lazy native population off of the welfare roles and let them go take the jobs the illegals are filling right now. And the businesses can pay a rate high enough to find said labor.
Among the Italians were the mafiosos, thus areas where Italians congregated greatly increased the crime rate:
“Certain kinds of criminality are inherent in the Italian race. In the popular mind, crimes of personal violence, robbery, blackmail and extortion are peculiar to the people of Italy.”
– 1911 Dillingham report
Also among them were literal anarchists. They set off bombs on wall street, in factories, and assassinated a U.S. President.
So no, I feel very comfortable in making this comparison. Compared to people a century ago, pretty much anyone looks stellar. People who come here today tend to be at least somewhat educated, and more pre-exposed to our culture.
The Problems 100 years ago were worse, we were a smaller nation, and yet we absorbed them. Convergence is the likely explanation for how that happened; the drive to join the middle class is able to smooth out quite a few things as it turns out.
Again, I don’t see any acknowledgement from you about ITINs; I suspect that your estimate doesn’t account for them, nor why immigrants would use them (FTR, it’s because it acts like a SS number, is far easier to get than a fake number, and you need an SS number for quite a few things here, like buying insurance) .
It’s because of ITINs, that the chief actuary of the Social Security has called illegal immigrants a net contributor, and based on the amount of money they’re getting, that about 2 out of 3 have them.
Nope, sampling error: the Second generation has itself yet to fully mature (they state this in the article), so the 3rd ends up as follows:
“No analysis of third-and higher-generation Hispanics or Asian Americans is included due to the small sample sizes of those subgroups in the survey data. Comparisons to the general public using data from other recent Pew Research Center surveys are included wherever possible.”
I’m willing to bet that if we wait for these groups to reach maturity, it will eventually show gen 3 earning slightly more than gen 2, at comparable points in time.
All we see in gen 3 figures is their progress up to this point.
Farms can’t. Meat packers can’t. Either you import the labor at the wage rates they can pay, or you import the food. That’s the “choice”, if you can even call it that.
Let’s break that down. 20 million illegals, 13 billion in SS payments. That’s about $750 per illegal. So you think the median Mexican citizen receives less than $750 a year in terms of food stamps, medical care, and education for their illegal children?
The original frame was of Federal taxes, which I’ll reiterate, is a system they are net contributors to.
When it comes to State and local services, who pay the lion share costs of emergency medical services and education, Illegals contribute an additional $10.6 billion per year according to a 2010 study.
They pay into the Highway Fund by buying gas, they pay property taxes, and they pay sales taxes.
I’ll also reiterate, the frame isn’t simply fiscal. Whether or not illegals are net contribute to the fiscal order turns simply on whatever Government policy is.
When it comes to their economic impact, there’s no comparison. They contribute close to 5x whatever benefits they consume, and by being here to increase economic growth, they increase tax revenues in other areas.
This, along with increasing the number of product and services our economy provides, and even increasing labor demand over time, leading to wages rising.
… You didn’t read the first part of that sentence.
If you you’re lacking people with high skills, that can mean certain business enterprises either can’t expand, or won’t exist in the first place. This is precisely what Newt Gingrich was bringing up during one of the 2012 debates, when he mentioned a place in California that had 5,000 jobs, and 5,000 unemployed, but the unemployed, weren’t qualified for those jobs.
The solution? Import people with those skills. They will then grow those businesses, increase their capacity, so they can then hire more people to do lower-skilled work.
My broader point though, is that this relationship is a two-way street. High skilled people equally need low-skilled persons to do work, to give them the opportunity to specialize.
It’s that otherside of the coin that many who talk about immigration tend to miss. In an economy, Labor is held in equilibrium, it’s not simply that one is good and the other is bad.
In fact, most immigration policy throughout history, and the world, is not a search for skills. It rather tends to be manpower drives.
BS. “Highly-skilled” workers aren’t coming into the country ILLEGALLY. What are being allowed to flood in are LOW-SKILLED, LARGELY UNEDUCATED “workers.” If we already HAVE many low-skilled workers unable to find work, WHY on Earth would we want to “import” more of the same? The .answer, of course, is that they are immediately placed on the welfare rolls, thus becoming the chattels of the Democrats, and if and when they are “legalized” they’ll become Democrat VOTERS, supporting the Party that was so “generous” to them when they first got here.
My take away from this thread is that the MORE illegals we can bring to this country the better off and wealthier we will be!!!
Me thinks the. STUPID elevator does not have a bottom floor.
“The The cost of illegal immigration to taxpayers is growing at an unsustainable pace”
Ttotal cost of illegal immigration to federal, state and local taxpayers for the nation’s 12.5 million illegal aliens has increased to $116 billion annually, according to a new study released Wednesday by the Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR). The study, one of the most comprehensive to date on the issue, investigates the major contributing factors driving the high cost of illegal immigration, and compares that to the revenue state and local governments collect from illegal aliens.“