Trump digs in on immigration


#1

The Democrats have been told, and fully understand, that there can be no DACA without the desperately needed WALL at the Southern Border and an END to the horrible Chain Migration & ridiculous Lottery System of Immigration etc. We must protect our Country at all cost!
— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) December 29, 2017, 09:32 AM

The president is boxing them in. They will all have to go home and explain in their re-election why chain migration and the lottery are good for America. Other than the hard core loony left, this will be a hard sell. I still think that the president’s position is a good one but Ann Coulter makes an interesting point in her usual bombastic style:

It has to be said that many of the legal and illegal low-wage workers, they’re incredibly hard workers, they’re really nice people, and it occurred to me … that I actually like all of the illegal immigrants except the DREAMers. They’re the ones I want deported first because they’re the activists. They’re the obnoxious ones. They’re the ones who go to congressional offices and stamp their feet and say, “How dare you not rush to grant us amnesty?” Whereas the other illegals don’t have the time to be protesting; they’re busy working, being polite, being so friendly and nice and saying, “Merry Christmas.”

No. Let’s start by deporting the DREAMers. That’s point one.

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2017/12/29/ann-coulter-no-daca-amnesty-until-theres-a-wall-and-hell-freezes-over/

In an ideal world I agree with Ann. However the President’s plan is possibly doable. The Wall, abolition of chain migration and the lottery will have a beneficial long term influence. These will not get done without support from some democrats as there will be several Republican intransigent holdouts; especially ones that are not up for re-election in November. Even with all Republicans onboard a plan without DACA would die from filibuster. It’s “The Art of the Deal”.


#2

? You can only end Chain migration by increasing caps on legal immigration.

Most Chain immigrants are not coming across the border; they’re coming here on planes. A wall does jack ****.

What you want is symbolic; not substantive. I don’t like the lottery system since its opaque, but it’s a footnote of the number of immigrants who come here, so I don’t get why you focus on it.


#3

BS, Slim. Why would you have to increase legal immigration in order to do away with chain migration…which as of today IS “legal” immigration?


#4

NumbersUSA explains what chain migration is:

Chain immigrants are coming here to stay with their legal immigrant relatives, until such time as they can apply for a green card personally.

You get permanent bodies of illegals, because the legal system accepts too few per year.

Give more avenues for people to apply personally through, and give more slots for people to apply for, permanent bodies of illegals go away.

Tailor legal immigration, to somewhere in the ballpark of the natural immigration rate.


#5

Chain migration brings in dozens of unskilled, uneducated immigrants that wouldn’t be acceptable immigrants on their own merits simply because they are related–however distantly–to other, legal immigrants. How many are “too few” in your world? We’re allowing roughly 1 million legal immigrants annually–which is probably sustainable, even though it’s vastly more than most of the rest of the industrialized world. Chain migration balloons that figure to 10 or more million, simply because their relative is willing to sponsor them, but SELDOM is responsible for them financially and many become wards of the state. The census data shows that something more than 50% of households with a foreign-born head are on some form of government assistance…legal OR illegal.


#6

Unskilled immigrants have a utility; they’re general purpose labor & their mobile.

They go where labor demands are, and they help higher skilled workers get the most out of their labor by giving them the opportunity to specialize.


#7

And MOST of those unskilled, uneducated invaders wind up on the dole…at OUR expense.


#8

At lower rates than Native Born Americans in the same income class.

They’re also a net boon to Social Security, according to the people who run it.


#9

Look, the thing that everyone seems to ignore is that these are ILLEGALS. I don’t care how skilled or qualified they might be in low or high professions My grandparents came from Italy LEGALLY, didn’t speak a word of English, and lived a life of poverty in Chicago until my grandfather went to night school for 10 years to earn his grammar school and high school diplomas. There were no ESL classes to help him learn the language. He either learned it himself or he suffered. He worked as a ditch-digger for Commonwealth Edison and when he retired, he had worked his way to a supervisor-inspector. No one helped him. So, I have no sympathy when it comes to ILLEGALS, I’m sorry. Call me hard-hearted, but if my grandparents could make it without coming illegally, then so can everyone else. You know that scene in Godfather II where Don Vito was on the boat with hundreds others in shabby and torn clothes? That was my grandfather. He came here in 1908 (he was 9 years old) with his father just like in the movie.


#10

Nonsense. Tell it to those who’ve had their SS numbers STOLEN by illegals and had their whole lives turned upside down.


#11

So did my Great-Grandparents, I have the picture of their sign-in documents from Ellis Island.

The Ellis Island system accepted 97% of people who came, our current system rejects over 70%.

Not the same world CT. Our current system doesn’t work.

Your grandparents wouldn’t have been able to navigate this:

Nor my own relatives. That’s why this is a travesty that all conservatives should reject.

It’s arbitrary rule-making, that shrinks the individual before the State, and turns away people who add to us the same way the Italians did.


#12

So says the Chief Actuary of the Social Security Administration, based on the amount of unreconcilable inflow the fund gets from ITINs.

He manages it Dave, He would know.


#13

BS. The Italians came in LEGALLY and with the aim of becoming AMERICANS. The Mexicans come in illegally with the aim of STAYING Mexicans and either changing US to THEIR ways or amassing a relative fortune and returning to retire as a “patrone” back in Mexico.


#14

You don’t think that immigrants like my grandparents and your great-grandparents didn’t go through a maze of bureaucracy AND cultural hardships??? Chicago was “civilized” by the Irish. The Irish had all the good job, government jobs, and police and fire departments. My grandfather waited DECADES before he finally was promoted. He had to wait for all the Irish guys below him were promoted and they had no one else they could promote! That’s just ONE example of what Italians had to go through. The “Black Hand” (the mafia) was putting all kinds of pressure on decent Italians who were just trying to make a living (and a very POOR one at that!) to either pay up or join up. My grandfather did neither. You can imagine what resulted.

Sorry, I don’t care how complicated and convoluted the system is. That is no reason to allow ILLEGALS to come here. NO REASON.


#15

Uh, BS. Mafiosos and others couldn’t give less of a crap, they created Italian-only enclaves all over the place.

Sorry, Dave, but you’ve never looked into this history. We had seriously bad adjustments getting them to assimilate; all you’ve ever known is the rose-tinted glasses version.


#16

Ah, so now all Italians are members of, or beholden to the Mafia in your world?


#17

Like that? No, because it didn’t exist. Once you were checked out & signed in, that was basically it. The Federal system was done with you.

It’s Federal system that creates the problem today.


#18

I’m Italian so… nice straw man there Dave. :vb-unhappy:


#19

I’m just quoting what YOU implied. What else is a “Mafioso”? I’m fully aware than Italian immigrants tended to settle in enclaves–especially in New York and New Jersey, but so did the Chinese, Vietnamese, Poles and even Germans. So what?


#20

So why were their enclaves “fine” and Mexican enclaves “destructive”?

You think the former didn’t have crime? You just spun me a yarn about what the Vietnamese did, and I know for a fact that the Chinese brought IEDs to America in the 1880s.