Was the election stolen from Trump?

1 The point is that it was contrary to the unity he called for. A lot of people wanted that wall.

2 From your own link:

It turns out that it was a memorandum and not an EO that reinstated U.S. Government funding of overseas abortion:

The link wanted to do funky things in the post preview, so I left it out. But you can do a search for the text; it came from the Washington Post.

And back on your link, I also found:

3 Did it ever occur to you that I don’t recall what all he did or said early in his presidency? I know he did a lot that made me do a facepalm (and I’ve admitted as much). He also did things that I like. I don’t recall what he said in his inauguration speech. Did he hammer on unity like Biden did?

4 Saying “unity” and doing the opposite isn’t wrong?

5 Actually, I’ll have to concede this one. I found “high crime” on the Merriam-Webster site, and it said “…that the U.S. Senate deems…” At first, I suspected that M-W had gone PC or something, but I found it in my own M-W unabridged with the same definition.

6 I did address it by de facto saying there is no remedy prior to the next election (which, by the way, had already happened by the time Trump was impeached the second time).

7 That I believe would in fact be worthy of impeachment.

8 Why couldn’t they have done that in the House instead of ramming it through?

9 I’m asking for the specifics, and what came of them legally.

10 So you keep saying. But you claim hypocrisy, when I’m not aware of Trump ever calling for Hillary to be jailed on any basis other than due process of law.

11 Trump couldn’t charge her; he wasn’t the AG. He wanted his people to investigate her, and they and the FBI wouldn’t.

“No crime,” eh? Everyone keeps a private e-mail server in their home for innocuous reasons, or a host of other activities that are suspicious at best, and scream “arrest me!” at worst…

12 Which is exactly what I’d like to see. I’m not holding my breath, though.

13 Says who? If one believes one’s political opponent has committed crimes and the only way to get them in jail is to get people to vote for you so you can “drain the swamp” and get people who’ll do their duty instead (Trump was unsuccessful), why not shout it from the rooftops?

Look, you’re turning “unity” into “Biden shouldn’t do things I don’t like”. I don’t think that’s what he meant by unity.

I took it to mean treat each other with respect and stop the decisive name-calling etc. It sounds to me like you think Biden shouldn’t be doing anything you don’t like.

Ok so stop work on the wall…I’m good with that.

The LGBTQ thing, I admit I don’t know much about it. If you know something specific that you think is wrong, post it, otherwise, I’ll see if I can find something.

I find that the reality is that those organizations do a lot more than perform abortions (like Planned Parenthood), so cutting funding to them causes harm as well, but again, you don’t post anything specific, so I’m left to guess.

The PPA doesn’t commit the US to anything binding. It’s more about global leadership and cutting carbon emissions is a good thing. You all fear an economic collapse where I think it could be a space the US could lead the world and create another economic boom.

But you do have a computer right? lol

Fair enough.

No, I’m sure it was quite the opposite, but honestly, I don’t remember either.

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Obviously, I’m never going to be able to answer that in a way that satisfies you, but given Trump’s very public conduct around the evens of the 6th, I believe it was justified. Ironically, given the procedural votes in the Senate, this may be the most bi-partisan impeachment and trial in history.

https://www.senate.gov/artandhistory/history/minute/War_Secretarys_Impeachment_Trial.htm

He tried to resign before leaving office and the Senate held his impeachment trial anyway.

Now if you read the constitution it gives the Senate the sole power to hold impeachment trial. It does not add the caveat, “only if the person is still in office”.

Further, it seems a rather large loophole to allow a person to resign or their time in office runs out (given that Republicans have proven they can push things of for more than a year) to avoid being convicted.in the Senate.

And lastly, the idea that a President could incite insurrection in his last few weeks in office and because his term runs out he is free from the consequences of impeachment? I think not.

Trump isn’t just an average Joe, he’s a former president and he is, or should be, privy to certain information. His conviction should put an end to his benefits as a former President IMO.

Trump had no problem firing people until he got the people he wanted. He’s the head of the executive branch, and while I certainly don’t agree with his tactics, he made no bones about interfering in the DOJ’s work. So you want me to believe Clinton was a sacred cow…lol If there is anyone on this planet that he could have gone after it was Clinton. Clinton’s support amount republicans are less than zero and even among dems it’s lukewarm at best.

That’s demagoguery. And let’s say your right, how could you tell the difference between a demagogue inciting to inspire a populist response (like Hitler) based on lies?

You’re the one upset about the lack of investigations, but a President can get up on his pulpit and spout conspiracy theories and demand the locking up of his political rivals at a rally filled with his supporters?

Notice that Biden has made zero response to the Impeachment since he’s been, President? He’s said that’s Congresses job?

Now imagine, if you will, him on TV and blasting through Twitter and all his surrogates on TV that Trump is evil and should be locked up? Heck, let’s though Kushner, Ivanka, Bannon, Stone and others, let Biden, in a populist speech riel up his base and tell them that the Republicans are thieves who though an insurrection tried to steal their dear leader from them?

I mean, regardless if any of this is real or not, it is representative of the kinds of inflammatory remarks that Trump made. So yeah, not doing that is a form of Unity.

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1 No. He took a hard left turn as soon as he entered office.

2 I did post something specific that you agreed earlier was wrong (whoever was doing it). But if you need it directly from the EO itself, here it is:

3 And so the unborn should be sacrificed on the altar of that “lot more?”
4 PP does not do a “lot more” than perform abortions, unless you count it by the number of different things they do, which 90% of their clinics do not. The vast majority of PP’s work is abortion. PP’s previous president Leana Wen was fired because she actually wanted to do those other things. From a statement she made on Twitter:

Here’s an NPR article that also shows the full “tweet”:


5 I couldn’t find an original for the Mexico City policy, or “global gag rule” as it’s disparagingly called, but you can get a lot of hits on a search (I actually did the search on “global gag rule”). PP had this to say about it (copied from the search page itself, from a hit on the PP website):

Emphasis (both italics and boldface) mine. I see now the Mexico City policy dates back to Reagan in '84.

6 There are a lot of noncommitments that lead to commitments, and Biden has made it clear he wants this sort of thing to be a binding reality.

7 Why should I do the legwork for you to try to find the evidence you claim? I’ve been doing it for you in regard to my claims about Biden (which you don’t seem to have heard about until I told you).

8 Wait a minute. Eleven Rs in the House for impeachment and six Rs in the Senate agreeing that it’s constitutional (the vote to convict may be even leaner) is bipartisan!?!!

9 I’ll let it ride for now, although I’ll note that it’s only one example, and it didn’t result in a constitutional challenge.
10 Who the crap said “free from consequences?” What part of “FBI” and “Biden’s AG” didn’t I make clear?

11 Except that apparently he never got the people he wanted.
12 I believe the facts support it. She and Bill have managed to leverage the system very well.
13 And that’s why she won the popular vote?

14 How is it demagoguery? He wasn’t talking about a lynch mob or throwing her in jail without due process (including an investigation). If he was, show me.
15 Biden makes about zero response to anything anymore. His handlers know that his foot-in-mouth disease is as bad as Trump’s.

16 Not hard to imagine, since all the other Ds in DC are doing it (at least in regard to Trump himself).
17 No. Not doing that means that someone has advised him on the benefits of keeping his mouth shut.

By the way, I’m still waiting for the evidence of the “rape accusations (that) weren’t all made up,” and the “stories of him walking through locker rooms of under-age half naked girls.”

Trump only hired the worst people.

Expect ones like “Mad Dog” Mattis who dumped on him after they left the administration. They are all “good guys.” You can’t have it both ways.

That is not how this works.

You do not create an economic boom by artificially replacing one industry with another. If you’re lucky, you get the same output as the old industry when it’s all said and done.

To be a boom, it would have to be more effective than the industry you’re replacing, and if that were the case, you wouldn’t need to force it.

The Green energy movement is crippled with bad horses (Wind, Ethanol, F***** waves) and charlatans like GE who simply use it as a means to save/get money. Until those get washed out, and the useful remainder technologies prove they can compete with fossil fuels without subsidies, there is no boom.

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Late reply, sorry.
There are many very interesting posts in this thread.
But this post is the most important of all. The subject it raises – the coming ‘realignment’ in American politics – deserves extensive discussion, in a new thread.
So forgive me for stealing it and using it to start such a thread.

My head is exploding with all these agree-with-Alaska-Slim moments…

Hey, did he take this bet or something? Haven’t seen him around since at least the inauguration

The accusation of straw manning is the poor man’s way out.

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Well, then straw manning in the first place is the poor man’s way in.

I know because you’re indoctrinated by the far right, you believe in authoritarian corporate rule. As a fascist, your ideas are dangerous, harmful, and rooted in white supremacy. I fear what you represent and everyone knows the more moderate Republicans like Romney are just puppets of the authoritarian far right.

See, I don’t believe any of that because it’s not based on anything you’ve said or done. Just a demonstration of the treatment CSB was getting.

@gutsandcasca believes in authoritarian corporations? Have you looked at the sweet heart deals the Democrats are making large, compliant corporations?

Gene literally said in that post he doesn’t believe that. He was giving a rhetorical example of straw manning.

More troubling is that Progressives certainly do want this, because the Government is a corporation, and Socialism by definition is Government running the means of production.

I think what most people mean by socialism is “energetic social safety net”, but they wouldn’t have the linguistic wherewithal to resist someone taking their support for socialism more literally.

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