Why are there so many socialists in the world?

I am a young person and my generation does not know what it is like to work hard and become successful. They are almost closet hippies. Now, I am a moderate liberal on certain social issues but far right on foreign policy, but I don’t say that government should provide everyone with free birth control. The liberals I am talking about hate the rich and their “traditional” parents. I want to be MORE successful than my parents and we live in a castle on a 2 acre property!

Yet, even though young people today advocate for liberal policies they do not embrace the entire hippie “way of life.” They hide under the protected shield of capitalism and freedom so that they can continue to parrot about how horrible being successful is. I don’t understand this. We saw this time and time again at the democratic convention! Filmmaker Michael Moore is a perfect example as well!

Every speech started with, “My parents worked hard and came from nothing. I barely afforded to go to college.” But their speeches made no sense at the end when they soon started to talk about government assistance programs and entitlements! What happened to my generation?

I am currently in the dating scene and none of the girls I have dated in my age group are republicans! In fact, no girls I have met have stated that they are a Republican. I’ve dated girls from Florida, NJ and NY. If we ever get to talking about politics then we see that we are not compatible in that area. I find it frustrating because I feel like I cannot connect with a liberal woman, which is part of the reason why I have not had much success in long term romantic relationships. My best friend is a conservative. He actually moved to Texas. So we talk a lot about politics, but its hard when he is so far away and he is one of my only friends I can talk about this with. I have met many older men, mentors in life who are republican but not as passionate about following politics as I am. (Not even my dad who is a life long Reaganite). I feel weird when I mention to people that I am a republican. My very liberal cousin who has just started college, covered my picture with an Obama poster at one of my grandmothers’ house when she visited. It was a joke, but it also says a lot about young people today. It’s a stigma to be republican and so young and passionate about it. There’s also a bias whenever I say I am a republican they somehow think I am a libertarian. I tell them its not the same thing, but young so-called republicans are generally thought to be Ron Paul supporters. Even by the mainstream media!

I feel really weird talking politics with anybody my age, and the people who are passionate about it, almost know nothing about what they are talking about. Granted they don’t follow the news and trends like a hawk…

So why do you think there are so many socialists in the world? Have you ever been demonized for being a republican? or Conservative?

I am proud to be a socialist, as was my grandfather who was converted to it by captured Sandanistas while he was a Horse Marine in Nicaragua in 1927. All up Daddy’s side we’re socialists of some form or another, and most of us are Unitarian Universalists to boot. If you want to get technical I’m an anarchosyndicalist/social anarchist who, in a demonstration of solidarity, has registered with the MA Green/Rainbow Party, though I’m probably going to write in Nader, just to make a point.

I’ll answer your question for you.

I’m convinced that it’s an unstoppable trifecta: The steady increase in global population; the incredibly fast advance of communications technologies; and a gradual realization that if the environmental scientists are right then robust capitalism poses an existential threat, and the scientists’ case gets a little stronger every day. With all these people socializing is it any wonder there are more socialists?

Politically, this country is drifting to the right. Saint Ronnie himself would be a barely tolerated moderate by today’s standards, and Republican victories have pushed an emulative left wing to the right. But there’s also no missing Gay Marriage, a black President, Medical Marijuana, and so on. It’s a tide nobody can stop.

As for women, let me show you some math:

3 male/female couples attend a party - 2 of the men are gay = 3 women for you!

Jjf3rd77…come join us…

Socialism looks good on paper, but ask anybody who lived under socialist regimes and you will hear a far different story.

If you think a socio-political system that has a blatant disregard for individual rights looks on paper, then maybe…For those of us who value individualism and our God-given rights to life, liberty, and property, socialism looks immoral on paper (and in practice is much worse).

Guys this is not a thread to bash socialism this thread asks a specific question. And although the only one to answer the question thus far has been a socialist, I appreciate his answer!

Well, there’s socialists. and there’s socialists. Everybody hated the USSR, but show me somebody from Vermont who’d live anywhere else! Ditto for France - citizen’s benefits are so generous that EVERYBODY wants in. It doesn’t have to be terrible - it’s extremely adaptable and you can dollop in as much or as little as voters allow…

Jjf, I think you worry a bit too much about what others post in your thread. If it is intentionally trying to derail your topic – then I’d understand. I think this is not the case here.

Anyway :smiley:

As for your questions:

So why do you think there are so many socialists in the world? Have you ever been demonized for being a republican? or Conservative?

Socialism is simpler to understand than free market and the invisible hand. Simple people don’t like systems that are too complex to understand. Socialism seems like an easy fix for their perceived problems.

We’re demonized all the time. Look at the trolls that stop in from time to time and spew their hate. Being hated means you’re standing up for something you believe in – and what they don’t realize is that free markets are the right solution. So, don’t look up to them and wish for their accepting smiles; no, pity them instead for having a poor grasp on economics and world history.

There are plenty of conservative chicks out there. Don’t dispair :grin:

It all starts with education.

In the US, there are relatively few real socialists. Most liberals believe in a mix of free market and collectivist policies, but not out and out socialism. Many self-proclaimed socialists don’t really understand the ideology, and the real socialists are completely divided amongst half a dozen third parties.

If you look at the world, you have to think outside of the left-right paradigm as defined in the American political context. In many third world countries, socialism is seen as a way to combat exploitative capitalist practices, fight against reactionary religious and social institutions, and to promote more social equality. Socialism does often have some benefits in these countries, as it (at least initially) brings into the political realm previously disenfranchised social classes, gives land and basic welfare to impoverished people, streamlines the bureaucracy in areas which were often quite local and primitive in their outlook before, builds state-sponsored infrastructure like roads and schools, and promotes socially progressive policies. You have to remember that I’m talking about countries that are the poorest of the poor, such as in Africa and South America. Unfortunately, these systems don’t always deliver due to a number of factors. First, the economy often isn’t developed enough to sustain a viable socialistic system, leading to disjointed and somewhat minimalistic social welfare programs. Also, the people who are put in charge of the government, as they often come from the lower classes, usually aren’t that educated don’t have the know-how to develop such a system. This often promotes inefficiency and corruption, something that is compounded by the fact that these governments usually aren’t democratic and thus those in power aren’t accountable to the average citizen. The top leaders, while often charismatic and sometimes quite well-educated, rely on demagoguery. Throw in the socialistic emphasis on “the people” being in charge, and that promotes vigilante justice against perceived political enemies. Therefore, put together these factors lead to violent situations like in Angola. Developed countries like Sweden and Norway have big social welfare systems that have worked out quite well.

When looking at socialist movements in Europe, again, disregard the American left-right dynamic. There are right-wingers in Europe who support expansion of social welfare policies. Like in developing countries, socialism was seen as a way to promote general equality and break down social barriers. America never suffered from kings, aristocracies and established religious institutions like most of the rest of the world did. Thus socialism did not have as much of an appeal here.

In it’s purest, cleanest form socialism is nothing less than workers owning the means of production. How can you say that owning your own business is bad? I see socialism as way station on the journey through social anarchism to the ultimate political goal of anarchosyndicalism, even though it may be 1,000 years out.

And as the sociological background slides inexorably to the left which approach best harnesses communications technology: The traditional rugged individualist or the feminized network geek?

OP hit the nail on the head when he stated that today’s youth is flocking to the left in percentages that would set you screaming, and he also correctly notes that most of them are as dumb as a box of rocks.

I think there’s something else going on with kids today, though I’m not sure it has anything much to do with left or right. The Baby Boom generation has spent everything their parents left them, and then they borrowed and spent everything their kids would make. Those kids are awakening to this fact, and they don’t much want to hear each side blaming the other.

My answer. Most are weak minded and weak willed due to a coddled upbringing. Opting for “fairness” is a lot easier than taking responsibility for one’s own lot in life.
And the teachers are overwhelmingly progressive socialists.

Another thing I’m wondering about…

The landscape that keeps sliding to the Left leaves the Right looking more extreme and inflexibly traditional. Kids want new stuff. How many are attracted to Socialism because it’s shinier?

If the environmental scientists are right I’d expect the Left’s presence to strengthen as resources are depleted. “Lifeboat Politics” and all that. But if we’re going to exploit the infinite resources of the Universe then some form of Ultracapitalism will probably work out the best, though I don’t think we’ll see it until we start strip-mining the Moon.

I’m usually wrong about stuff like this.

  1. The problem with socialism, as the old joke goes, is that eventually you run out of other people’s money. It happened in the Soviet Union, and it’s happening now in European countries (including France), and also in California. No, it isn’t adaptable; it’s a malignant tumor. If it isn’t destroyed where it’s at, it’ll grow while devouring everything within reach. Then it devours itself.
  1. By and large, there’s nothing but their own lack of responsibility stopping them from purchasing their own means of production.

Did I really just read someone post “If the environmental scientists are right”? Why not ask monkeys could write books? After all the chances are the same.

I really do not understand why anyone would think giving all power to the Government is a good thing. When you give the Government the power to provide everything for you, you also give them the power to withhold those things. The one thing that every socialist I ahve ever known has failed to take into account is the absolute that power corrupts.

[quote=“Dacabeti, post:14, topic:36128”]
Did I really just read someone post “If the environmental scientists are right”? Why not ask monkeys could write books? After all the chances are the same.

I really do not understand why anyone would think giving all power to the Government is a good thing. When you give the Government the power to provide everything for you, you also give them the power to withhold those things. The one thing that every socialist I ahve ever known has failed to take into account is the absolute that power corrupts.
[/quote]:howler: who posted that?

jj3rd, this is simply speculation on my part, but I think some of the answer lies with what Hans (whom I don’t agree with, elsewise), brought up. The Baby Boom generation. But skip the spending part, 'cuz the kids of the BB’s were already brought up long before gov’t spending entered their craniums.
Much of the Baby Boom generation, (of which I’m accused of being at the tail end of @ 54), thought they ‘could have it all’. It was also a generation of keeping up with - or trying to outdo - the Jones’s. Throw in a good measure of Feminazi’s, and oh, what a mix!
This was a generation so busy chasing the golden ring - and making sure THEY got so-called “equal rights”, that they allowed the gov’t schools and nannies to raise their children. Plenty of whom were self-proclaimed Republicans and/or Conservatives.
Well, you do learn what you live, and live what you learn, so it should come as no surprise that the children born of such selfishness - and handed every gadget on earth to make up for the abandonment - are selfish, themselves.

But there are plenty of exceptions! So, like J.Galt said, do not despair! For example, both my kids, (27 &28), are self-reliant, ambitious go-getters who own businesses of their own. (Sorry, both married. Besides, one’s a guy. lol)
As a little word of unsolicited advice on the dating scene - quit shopping in N.Y. and N.J., and start shopping in TX, or at least the south. You’ll have much better luck! (All smiles, of course, from my end.)
Btw, just how young, is “young?”

Right there my friend, right there. I had to read it a few times to make sure I saw what I saw.

Sayeth Cam, “My answer. Most are weak minded and weak willed…”

My side says the same about Christians. I think both of you are wrong.

And the teachers are overwhelmingly progressive socialists.”

You and your side are welcome to go right on believing that, and when you get tired of scratching your heads and cussing because you lost another election use

Voter Lists Online | Aristotle

and discover that almost none of them are.

Fantasy Chaser, “1. The problem with socialism, as the old joke goes, is that eventually you run out of other people’s money.”

LOLOL!!! Without Communists to prop us up our economy would have collapsed decades ago. How much are we borrowing from Red Mao Pinko Communist China each day just to keep the lights on? $2 Billion? How much do we owe them already? $2.1 trillion? $2.6? WE OWE THE COMMUNISTS SO MUCH MONEY IT’S HARD TO KEEP TRACK OF IT ALL!

Dacabeti, “Did I really just read someone post “If the environmental scientists are right”? Why not ask monkeys could write books?”

New England has seen local cold-region butterfly numbers drop by 90%, while the numbers of warm-region butterflies not usually seen here have grown by over 1000%. Climate Change Affecting Butterflies - Science News - redOrbit

If you want to deny climate change you’re wasting your breath on me, but you’re welcome to explain everything to the liberal butterflies who must have been flimflammed by the socialist mainstream media - lured up here by promises of giant welfare checks and gay marriage, else they would not have moved so far north…

I think we should get back to OP. Left OR Right, I’m pretty sure we agree on what this young man needs.


Okay OP. Here’s one: As you’re no doubt aware, just about everybody is a vegetarian now, including the hypothetical purple-haired goth/emo/scene/whatever girl you want to get to know at the hypothetical party.

As soon as you learn that she’s a vegetarian you mention that you have a recipe for mock chicken salad that is absolutely incredible, you had one earlier today and blah blah blah it was good. Women love food, so you’ll have her total attention when you say that you start with plain tempeh. You cut it up into pieces the same size and shape you would if it was chicken. “Cup your hand,” you’ll say while holding your cupped hand up. As soon as she does the same slowly take her by her wrist with your left hand and with your right hand trace the amount of heapage there would be if the hand were full of chopped tempeh. At this point, eyeball the hand and the imaginary heapline. You’re trying to get about a tuna can’s worth of tempeh. Explain to her: “I’m trying to eyeball about a tuna can’s worth, and your hands small. Maybe, three, three and a half handfuls like this.”

You’re standing right up next to her, holding her wrist. Go ahead and give her a smile. The cat’s out of the bag. She knows what you’re up to. Release her wrist and step back ONLY A HALF-STEP. You want it to seem like you’re giving her some room, but your ulterior motive is the closer the better.

You put the tempeh in a bowl and you add one handful of quartered red grapes, then one tablespoon plain yoghurt and one teaspoon stone ground brown mustard. Cut a wheat pita in half and fill pocket with an arugula leaf and the mock chicken salad, you tell her, never crossing your legs, arms, or eyes. “It’s SOOOOO GOOOD…” you say as throatily as possible while looking like you’re remembering a moment of true bliss.

If you pull it off you’re in striking distance of a purple-haired honey who is now associating the concept of “you” with the concept of “yummy.”

Here’s that recipe. Make it once for the body memory, and heck, why not use it as an excuse for a date? Go out and get all the ingredients, and call up some other vegetarian chick and ask if she wants to supervise while you try to master a new recipe.

Here it is:

Plain Tempeh - Chopped. About a tuna can’s worth.

Red Grapes - Quartered. About a handful.

Plain Yoghurt- 1 TABLEspoon.

Stone Ground
Brown Mustard- 1 TEAspoon.

Arugula - 1 leaf.

Wheat Pita - 1/2 (a pocket)

As I think about other ways to scoop socialist tomatoes I’ll post them! lol

The point I was trying to make is if I find out a girl is a vegetarian or a vegan. I know that she’ll be fun for the night or two, but we would be incompatible in the long run! Because most vegetarians are liberal. Most vegetarians do not eat meat because “it harms the animals.” I’m not going to go out of my way to make her a vegan meal, when I don’t even like that stuff… Especially since I know we won’t be going into a long term relationship.

I guess I need to move to alaska lolz.

I’ve found that there are two forms of “chemistry.” The first requires in-person contact, and I’m sure most of us have felt it: You look into the other person’s eyes and both of you instantly understand that if we were still cave men both of you would be having sex in the bushes, regardless of who is committed to whom. That kind of attraction can be very destructive.

There’s another kind, though. It can strike in person, through chat rooms and email, or over the phone. It’s “chemistry,” but one that hits you in the brain, heart, and soul all at once. You don’t even have to ask if she’s feeling it - you’ll know and she’ll know you know. It’s incredible.

If that happens to you, don’t worry one bit about her politics, because you’ll find a way. Does anybody remember James Carville and Pat Buchannan’s sister? I forget her name. Anyway, they were a pair of uber-sharp Democrat and Republican strategists who fell in love and got married. If you ever do get that way-rare spark with a girl, you make it work!

I want to hear somebody else’s opinion on the title of this thread, but I’m not sure many of the readers here really understand what’s going on. I do, but I’m not sure WHY it’s going on. You have to wade around in it, so

Why do YOU think there are so many socialists? Why THIS generation?